My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

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Spram
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My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby Spram » Sat Feb 06, 2016 2:36 am

aaasss

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Mothra
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Re: My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby Mothra » Sat Feb 06, 2016 4:05 pm

Hey man, sorry you're having to go through this shit. It sounds exhausting and awful.

You've got friends here, and we're always around if you want to ask us anything.

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François
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Re: My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby François » Sat Feb 06, 2016 5:23 pm

In my experience, there are two sorts of attitudes that make a person highly resistant to self-improvement.

"I'm a good person, everything I like is good, I rarely make mistakes, if I do make a mistake I always mean well so there's no point in punishing me, and if something hurts me or makes me sad or angry then it's a bad thing and it needs to go away."

"I'm the filthiest sort of garbage. I'm trash. There's no point in trying to make trash better. I'll be trash until I die, and then I'll be dead trash. I should probably be dead already."

It kinda sounds like your mother has both. It's possible. I've seen it happen. They just switch from one to the other at the drop of a hat. I'd bet good money most people around here have known people like that. It doesn't necessarily make them all bad people, but it does make them into people who largely lack the capacity to become better over time. They live in a world where there are only good people and bad people; if you're good you don't need to change anything, and if you're bad then you're beyond redemption forever.

Of course that's not how the real world works. People are a lot more complicated than that, and when things are complicated they require thinking about. Now imagine how many people never bother thinking about others, and then realize that there are even more people who never bother thinking about themselves. They don't have the clarity of vision and the honesty to think "this is a person, there are good things and bad things about that person, and this is me, there are good things and bad things about me".

Where am I going with this? The point is, your mother's perspective is flawed. When she yells at you, she's not actually yelling at you. She's yelling at the person she believes you are at the time, with her clouded vision and her simplistic view of the world. If you were different, she'd find some other reason to yell at you. If it was anyone else in your shoes, they'd be getting yelled at by your mother. It's not personal. I know it feels personal, and I know it hurts deep, because culturally we're trained to take it to heart when our parents tell us stuff, but it's not actually personal. And that goes double if it turns out her mind is going for whatever reason.

Cutting ties would probably be a good solution, but you say that it's not an option. And you know what? I don't know better about your own situation than you do, and you're an adult, and I have no reason to believe you're lying to us. If you say that's not an option, then I trust you, it must not be one. So if we're working from the premise that you have to coexist and at least pretend to get along, and that your mother isn't going to mellow up, what's the course of action?

When a crisis happens, remind yourself that it's not about you. The sun is hot, dogs bark, poop smells bad, your mother yells. There's no point getting upset about any of that stuff. She's not really mad at you, she's just mad and hurting in general because she's afraid of what she doesn't understand and she doesn't understand the world. And maybe her brain hormones are messed up. That's not your fault. It doesn't make you a bad person any more than being in the company of a blind person makes you invisible.It's okay and normal to love your mom, just like it's okay and normal to love your old cat who can't hold it in and keeps peeing on the carpet. But don't take it personally. I know it's hard, I know it hurts, but you can try to build that sort of emotional distance or barricade over time. When you get along, she really does love her son, because it's true that you're her son regardless of her perspective or insight. But when you don't, remember that she's not screaming at you. She's screaming at a phantom who's wearing your face.

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Grath
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Re: My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby Grath » Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:15 pm

François wrote:It kinda sounds like your mother has both. It's possible. I've seen it happen. They just switch from one to the other at the drop of a hat. I'd bet good money most people around here have known people like that. It doesn't necessarily make them all bad people, but it does make them into people who largely lack the capacity to become better over time. They live in a world where there are only good people and bad people; if you're good you don't need to change anything, and if you're bad then you're beyond redemption forever.

When I was a kid, we had a friend who did that. It ended up ruining her marriage, IIRC, and also ruined my parents' friendship with her. It's also a recognized psychological thing - common in people with borderline personality disorder or narcissism.

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François
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Re: My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby François » Sun Feb 07, 2016 4:31 pm

Dang, I should have known that this would be that sort of thing, thanks for the link mang.

These sorts of personalities often end up cultivating in their immediate environment people who will be reluctant to challenge their binary perspective, and that's easiest to accomplish through familial links. And you end up with basically little groups of people wrapped together in toxic cocoons that dispense a little basic comfort, but also a lot of misery. I mean, when she's harassing your brother to "act like a normal person", on one hand it's because to her normal is Good, and abnormal is Bad, but it's also because your brother's part of her little manufactured shelter, and she's using her family as a refuge from the complicated, nuanced world outside. She can't recognize your brother for who he is, with the good parts and the bad parts, just like she can't recognize you, or even herself, because she needs everyone inside her cocoon to be "good" to feel safe.

If you really can't get out of it, you gotta remember that she's disconnected from reality in a fundamental way, and regardless of her opinion, you're not being weak or fragile or worthless. That you can even put up with her behavior at all to appreciate the occasional better moment is a pretty impressive display of resilience. And that you have it in yourself to talk about that stuff honestly like you have, that's also really healthy! You already have the self-control not to inflict violence on your family even in deep crisis mode, and that puts you far above a hell of a lot of people and counts for more than you imagine. The next step is having the self-control not to inflict violence on yourself, but in any case, even if you're not quite there yet, don't forget the assets you do have already, that you can build on.

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sei
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Re: My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby sei » Sun Feb 07, 2016 11:37 pm

A bunch of Spram's anecdotes read like textbook examples of narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) traits.

she told me that "YOU JUST LIKE TO FIGHT" [NPD blaming + inability to admit fault]
...
She likes to get angry and reflect every thing you throw at her even if she has to change the subject. She always wants to be right. [NPD inability to handle criticism]
...
she was screaming like a wild thing and even crying and asking what she did to deserve this. It seems she wanted a perfect "Sound of Music" [NPD entitlement / exceptionalism, in her thinking she deserves a perfect family]
...
I HAVE ALWAYS WANT TO DIE [NPD always/never statement]


Spram, read these:
If you think she has narcissistic personality disorder, you can probably find support from people who have gone through similar stuff at one of these forums:
old Jewish people used to pass on the sins into innocent animals and then kill them


When I think of Jews passing sins on to animals, I think more of ducks being given chametz around Passover, or taschlich around Rosh Hashana.

Then again, kaparot's PETA level is over 9000.
Image

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Caithness
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Re: My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby Caithness » Sat Feb 13, 2016 8:17 pm

I hope you didn't die, Spram.

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Spram
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Re: My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby Spram » Thu Mar 17, 2016 2:36 am

Spram wrote:Sorry for the rant. I took 10 mg of Klonopin and I'm about to fall down and sleep forever.



Well. This explains why I don't remember writing this at all.

This is embarrassing.

Thanks for the advice.

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François
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Re: My parents, specially my mom. (long and awkward)

Postby François » Thu Mar 17, 2016 10:31 am

Dude, that's not embarrassing. Going on a tear and breaking things and hurting people would have been embarrassing. You sought sympathy and advice from people who are inclined to support you, and that's easily among the best reflexes you can have in a situation like that.

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