The Eeeeew

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Brentai
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Brentai » Mon Jan 23, 2017 3:14 am

Thad wrote:The problem, as I see it, is that you're presupposing wise, knowledgeable, and well-meaning elected officials. That's a worthy goal, but I'm not sure it's an attainable one. I think some level of trust of government is necessary, but some level of suspicion is, too.


Not "presupposing" of course... "expecting" I'll accept though. I think it's a reasonable expectation, and also reasonable to expect a working system of checks and balances to enforce that.

If the same people who voted to elect Doug Ducey also voted to increase the minimum wage, and Doug Ducey opposes a minimum wage increase, does that mean that the voters picked Ducey because they defer to his judgement on the subject, or does it mean that they voted on a referendum specifically because, while they like Ducey better than DuVal as a whole, they disagree with him on the minimum wage?


Yes and also yes. I don't see those two possibilities as exclusive, necessarily.

I do recognize that the possibilities are exclusive under the current system of "the public demands a thing, the legislature tells the public to fuck off, and that's the end of the story." Ideally, I would see the conversation run like this:

PUBLIC: We want a minimum wage increase and have voted for a (non-binding) referendum in favor of it.
DUCEY, ET. AL.: In my position as Governor (et. al.) I cannot support a minimum wage increase. I will not honor this referendum and urge the public not to pursue further action.
PUBLIC: [If not in agreement.] We still want a minimum wage increase and have voted for a (binding) initiative in favor of it.
DUCEY, ET CETERA: Then it's out of our hands and we have done our jobs to the best of our ability as we see fit.

"Give the public veto power over the legislature" might be a pretty hard sell but it's something I think we need at this point in our push towards a More Perfect Union.

But I also don't see it as much of a betrayal -- I think Brexit really is a foregone conclusion at this point, that a last-minute attempt by the minority parties to scuttle it won't accomplish anything except possibly generating even more economic uncertainty, and that there will be other, better hills to die on if they save their political capital.


Given the public reaction that I've seen, if their purpose was to conserve their political capital, they have fucked it up.

I mean, I'd probably vote No if I were an elected official. But that's one of many reasons I'll never hold political office.


The President of the United States is a serial sexual molester, and I mean, not even a meme one on a message board or anything. He's my IRC character in real life. If you don't think you can do better than my IRC character, you've got a serious clinical case of self-loathing going on.

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Mongrel
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Mongrel » Mon Jan 23, 2017 3:20 am

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Friday
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Friday » Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:10 am

The President of the United States is a serial sexual molester, and I mean, not even a meme one on a message board or anything. He's my IRC character in real life. If you don't think you can do better than my IRC character, you've got a serious clinical case of self-loathing going on.


This isn't a dig at anyone in particular (or a dig at all, really) but

I remember back in November? when I made an offhand comment in #ff that "anyone here, in the channel, would make a better president than Trump" and some people hemmed and hawed about it like "i'm not sure i'd be that great"

it was at that moment that I realized just how much people are really unsure of themselves, because jesus christ

Here, let me put it another way:

If I was given a magic wand that would magically change the president to a random active poster on these boards excluding myself, I would immediately wave that shit so hard my arm would snap off.

I mean as is. I don't mean "after a year of prep of political course, history, etc"

Just you, as you exist now. Dumped directly into the situation room with a possible nuclear strike bearing down on us. 100% better than Trump.
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Brentai
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Brentai » Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:32 am

Friday wrote:excluding myself


Wait a minute...

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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby zaratustra » Mon Jan 23, 2017 5:50 am

Now I'm picturing Guild explaining why Russia's hacking of the DNC servers means they are actually werewolves

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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Mongrel » Mon Jan 23, 2017 5:52 am

Vote: scum.
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Friday
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Friday » Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:10 am

Brentai wrote:
Friday wrote:excluding myself


Wait a minute...


Well, I mean, I think I would also make a better president than Trump. I was just excluding myself to make the point that it doesn't have to be a personal thing. I don't think I'd make the best president out of everyone here, but my point was anyone here is better than Trump.

Now I'm picturing Guild


CURRENT ACTIVE POSTERS AT THE TIME OF THIS POST ONLY

I mean, I'm not sure. Cassius might actually be better.
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Defenestration » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:24 am

Friday wrote:If I was given a magic wand that would magically change the president to a random active poster on these boards excluding myself, I would immediately wave that shit so hard my arm would snap off.


Guild

Edit: Damn, beaten to it
Una salus victis nullam sperare salutem

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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Hardly Ideal » Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:02 pm

I was just thinking about Gary Johnson's "What is Aleppo?" moment the other day. I'm not sure how many of us can find Aleppo on a map, but I think most of us know that Aleppo is the site of a human rights disaster and not a new type of Pokemon.

I'm pretty sure our understanding that nukes are bad thanks to collective Metal Gear fandom puts us head and shoulders above The Bastard and his fascination with them.

Hell, anyone who can lead a raid or DM a D&D campaign could probably be a better president as-is. Yes, even you there, hammy-Jedi-roleplayer-with-the-bad-British-accent-and-everything.
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Mongrel » Mon Apr 24, 2017 10:07 pm



I mean, I'm not sure these dots actually connect that cleanly or easily since that would mean 4chan controls the internet (okay maybe that's arguably possible, lol wait...), but drawing attention to this sort of fellow-travelling is still important.
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Thad » Fri May 05, 2017 6:32 pm

Latest polls show Marcon up by 20 points. I'm not taking anything for granted, but it may be worth pointing out that the polls before Brexit and Trump were off by about 5 points and that's considered a massive polling error. And, not for nothin', French polls have been extremely accurate as recently as two weeks ago.

Again, nothing for granted. And hey, France, PLEASE get your asses out and vote.

But I'd sure like to see the tide turn, please, and a twenty-point rebuke to a fucking fascist would do ever so nicely.

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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Cait » Fri May 05, 2017 7:17 pm

Turns out "4chan" gave Wikileaks a bunch of hacked e-mails from Macron right before the election. How inconceivable.

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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Thad » Fri May 05, 2017 7:47 pm

What I'm reading in the Post is that even Wikileaks is saying "Hey, a lot of this shit looks fake."

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Hardly Ideal
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Hardly Ideal » Sun May 07, 2017 4:21 pm

I don't want to jinx it, but Macron is leading Le Pen by 25 points with 61% reporting.

Here's hoping they say non, merci to fascism, but that bit about voting for dinner still comes to mind:
You're trying to decide on dinner, so you put it to a vote. Three people vote for pizza,
and two vote to kill you and eat you. Sure, pizza won the day, but those other two guys are still there.
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Mongrel » Sun May 07, 2017 4:38 pm



Applaudir, SVP
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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Thad » Sun May 07, 2017 5:13 pm

Hardly Ideal wrote:I don't want to jinx it, but Macron is leading Le Pen by 25 points with 61% reporting.


Washington Post currently says 30 points.

Point taken about 35% of the population voting "kill and eat you"; 35% is a fuck of a lot from that perspective. But it's also "UFOs exist" territory. It's a larger-than-comfortable fringe, but it's still a fringe.

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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Mongrel » Sun May 07, 2017 8:21 pm

Let the salt flow:

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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Mothra » Sun May 07, 2017 8:55 pm

Mongrel wrote:

Applaudir, SVP

JEB JEB JEB JEB

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Re: The Eeeeew

Postby Mongrel » Mon May 08, 2017 1:17 pm

The Guardian has a new longform piece on Cambridge Analytica

An American commentator wrote:This is Britain in 2017. A Britain that increasingly looks like a “managed” democracy. Paid for by a US billionaire. Using military-style technology. Delivered by Facebook. And enabled by us.


No time to read it just yet, will edit this post with any thoughts later if it's worth commenting.
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