Impeachment

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Thad
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Thad » Wed Jan 29, 2020 10:30 am

There are reports that there are enough votes to call witnesses. So far, they're anonymously sourced; take it with a grain of salt until the vote actually happens. Always be wary of the "Collins and Romney will save us" narrative.

If anyone's called, it'll be Bolton. I figure Schiff's team will probably also try to call the rest of the witnesses who refused to testify in the House.

If they have to call witnesses, I expect the Republicans will call Hunter and/or Joe Biden. There's been talk since the trial started of a "witness trade" -- "We'll allow Bolton to testify if you allow Hunter Biden to testify." That's silly, for a variety of reasons, not least of which is that the Republicans have a majority and do not need any Democratic votes to call a witness.

Calling either Biden is a win for Trump's side because it muddies the waters, it reinforces the narrative that Hunter Biden really was doing something corrupt in Ukraine and Trump was right to call for an investigation. (Plus, I want Joe Biden to lose the primary, but I don't want it to be because of this, and I don't want it to look like it's even possible it was because of this.)

Regardless, even if Republicans do their best to turn it into a circus, if the impeachment team gets to call more witnesses then that's a big fucking deal. It still probably doesn't mean Trump gets convicted, but it brings it one step closer, and could make for some huge gains in the court of public opinion.

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Thad
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Thad » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:16 pm

Impeachment fan fiction: the Senate calls the Bidens. They don't show up; they're like "Oh, I heard it was OK to just ignore congressional subpoenas." Dare the Senate to have them arrested and then have to justify not doing the same for Mulvaney.

Real life: this wouldn't work, because Republicans have already abandoned all pretense of being motivated by anything but partisanship, and 43% of the public doesn't care.

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Brentai
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Brentai » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:09 pm

You definitely lose the claim that you're the Presidential candidate who isn't going to try and munchkin both the letter and the spirit of the law.
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Thad
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Thad » Wed Jan 29, 2020 6:01 pm

I guess you're right. Showing total contempt for the rule of law while simultaneously claiming to be a champion of law and order only works if you're a Republican.

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Brentai
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Brentai » Wed Jan 29, 2020 8:06 pm

As it should be, or else your political parties are just Donald Trump and Donald Trump with Extra Avocado.
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Blossom
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Blossom » Thu Jan 30, 2020 12:41 am

Well, when the comparison is between a racist, sexist, homophobic, criminal dinosaur with a penchant for sexually assaulting children, or Donald Trump ...
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Blossom » Thu Jan 30, 2020 3:05 am

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McDohl
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Re: Impeachment

Postby McDohl » Fri Jan 31, 2020 8:20 am

I held out hope.

I held out hope that Republicans would see an opportunity to excise a tumor from their ranks and stop killing this country.

But they won't. Because I'm a fucking mark.

And now, today, shitty, disgusting white people will vote to usher in a fascist dictatorship because they have no sense of patriotism or historical context. They only care about themselves.

And people will continue to suffer.

I hate Republicans.
I hate Trump.
I especially hate McConnell. They can all fuck off.

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Thad
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Thad » Fri Jan 31, 2020 1:24 pm

I'm pretty fucking disheartened too, but I do wish the media wouldn't call the results of a vote before it actually happens.

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Re: Impeachment

Postby McDohl » Fri Jan 31, 2020 1:42 pm

Its social media calling it already, which is what's got me disheartened.

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Mongrel
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Mongrel » Fri Jan 31, 2020 9:04 pm

Well, it's confirmed now. No witnesses.
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Thad
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Thad » Mon Feb 03, 2020 2:14 pm

I didn't realize I still had the capacity to get this upset over something I considered a foregone conclusion.

("This" being the refusal to call witnesses. The acquittal still hasn't happened just yet, but it's another foregone conclusion that I expect will make me very unhappy when it does.)

But, well, I just gotta hope that all this makes a difference in November.

This and whatever else happens in the next nine months. Trump's stonewalling may have allowed him to survive impeachment, but it's also likely that it means a bunch of bad news about everything from Ukraine to his taxes coming out right before the election.

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Re: Impeachment

Postby McDohl » Mon Feb 03, 2020 2:50 pm

Hes gonna do everything he can to keep his taxes under wraps.

And the courts will let him, because in this hell timeline, good people are not permitted anything that could generate joy.

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Re: Impeachment

Postby McDohl » Mon Feb 03, 2020 2:51 pm

I'm sorry I'm so negative of late.

I'm just so exhausted.

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Thad
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Thad » Mon Feb 03, 2020 3:31 pm

I don't think even this Supreme Court is going to let the "the president can't be investigated for anything, for any reason, while in office" argument ride.

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Re: Impeachment

Postby McDohl » Mon Feb 03, 2020 5:51 pm

McDohl wrote:Hes gonna do everything he can to keep his taxes under wraps.

And the courts will let him, because in this hell timeline, good people are not permitted anything that could generate joy.


Of course I say this the day Rush Limbaugh announces he has lung cancer.

Fuck cancer, and fuck Limbaugh.

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Thad
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Thad » Mon Feb 03, 2020 6:47 pm

It bears remembering that Limbaugh spent years spreading Big Tobacco propaganda about how tobacco doesn't cause cancer.

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Upthorn
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Upthorn » Mon Feb 03, 2020 6:48 pm

Thad wrote:I don't think even this Supreme Court is going to let the "the president can't be investigated for anything, for any reason, while in office" argument ride.

I long for the days when I had your naïve optimism.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.

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zaratustra
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Re: Impeachment

Postby zaratustra » Mon Feb 03, 2020 7:24 pm

i mean they don't have to let it ride

the president is a master of legal waffling

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Thad
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Re: Impeachment

Postby Thad » Mon Feb 03, 2020 7:44 pm

Upthorn wrote:
Thad wrote:I don't think even this Supreme Court is going to let the "the president can't be investigated for anything, for any reason, while in office" argument ride.

I long for the days when I had your naïve optimism.

It's not optimism, it's just a different kind of cynicism.

Conservative Supreme Court justices are similar to conservative elected officials, but they're not quite the same thing. They aren't running for reelection; they're thinking past the next election and they're aware that, no matter how much they gut the Voting Rights Act and uphold gerrymandering, sooner or later there's probably going to be another Democratic president.

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