Undertale

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zaratustra
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Re: Undertale

Postby zaratustra » Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:42 pm

schpoilers

  • naming your character and creator the same yields a quip, naming the character "frisk" does nothing
  • toby getting into the fanmade AU business i see
  • wow, toby has a budget this time around
  • susie is a cool gal i'm sure we'll be fr
  • oh
  • did some kind of flashforward happen there?
  • seems not
  • ok i'm sure this demo will end any minute now
  • nope still going
  • and going
  • wow this is pretty big
  • ok done
  • jesus CHRIST what is all this post-game CONTENT man ALIVE
  • characters please stop calling me out for going into literally every room and talking to literally everyone
  • o.... k that was an end

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Friday
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Re: Undertale

Postby Friday » Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:24 pm

Alright, I'm gonna take a stab at what I think is going on using what meager evidence is available to us.

This is all post game stuff, so if you haven't beaten the game yet, don't read this.

I am pretty sure this isn't the original Undertale universe. There's a lot of really obvious evidence to support this, like Undyne not knowing who her dino-lesbian is, Kris not being Frisk (though almost, just backwards without the F) and Catty and Bratty hating each other.

At the start of the game, we're asked to make a vessel and then give OUR name. The game discards all your choices but YOUR name and shunts you into Kris. It then tells us that our choices don't matter, and they don't. You can't actually kill anyone (monsters flee if reduced to zero hp) and can't gain execution points (exp).

The first time you save, you're overwriting Kris' file with YOUR NAME. That's a pretty clear indicator that you've taken over someone's life as of you loading/playing the game. People in town also comment how you're a lot more chatty and less creepy.

I believe the thing that's taken over is Frisk/and/or/the player. A veteran of Undertale in either case. This is because you can spam hug Ralsei and also because you can tell sans you know him. sans is... mysterious and seems to possibly pretend he doesn't know you.

I don't believe you were brought here to stop Chara from murdering everyone, because Kris isn't (wasn't) Chara, and also Chara would have fucking killed everyone a long time ago. But I do believe that you 'brought her/him along' when you took over Kris.

So whats going on? Why bring Frisk in at all? Most people think it has to do with Gaster, because he's featured pretty damn prominently with the Cell Phone playing his theme. And also the Bunker that plays his theme really quietly and at like 1/5 speed south of town.

So maybe Gaster is trying to reform himself or something? And created this alternate/scrambled universe?

sans himself being sans and "just moving to town" makes me suspect that he's sans prime, and not an AU sans. He's here doing his job as time cop, hunting down either Gaster, or Chara, or both.

The voice that talks to you at the start and when you die is probably Gaster, at least in my opinion. Why he's forcing a pacifist runthrough in an AU Undertale, I don't know.


Anyway, that's enough rambling. I'm sure at least 60% of what I just said will turn out to be wrong. Oh well. It's fun to think about!
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Mongrel
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Re: Undertale

Postby Mongrel » Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:33 pm

Grath wrote:Also,

BTW, any particular precautions to take in this regard? "Directory" could be interpreted a couple ways in this regard.
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Grath
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Re: Undertale

Postby Grath » Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:52 pm

Mongrel wrote:
Grath wrote:Also,

BTW, any particular precautions to take in this regard? "Directory" could be interpreted a couple ways in this regard.

Don't use the uninstaller and just delete the folder the game is in if you decide to uninstall it?

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Friday
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Re: Undertale

Postby Friday » Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:58 pm

yeah as long as you don't use the actual "uninstaller" that came with the game, you're fine.
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WingSounds
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Re: Undertale

Postby WingSounds » Wed Oct 31, 2018 11:53 pm

I'm fashionably late, as ever. Halloween was great, but unfortunately I might need to be gone from the computer for a bit - got me glummer than normal, since I actually have people I enjoy talking to, now...

Uhmn, so! Do you mind if I jump in? I'll spoil the real stuff, but my most important thoughts:

Niku wrote:i would die for susie


me... too...
I'm actually weak against girls I think might be cooler than me...
I just want to smoke with her outside the bleachers, or she can eat star candy, or whatever...
But I also love Ralsei because fluffy soft boys are nice.

Also - ugh, it really is all spoilers, huh? Okay, so here we go:

Has anyone found all the key fragments yet? I ran out of time to explore and find them all. Feel free to spoil it for me, or in a PM. That whole thing with the Darkener shopkeeper puppet seemed like it'd reveal some more of what Friday was getting at? I wish I could quote you in spoilers, without spoiling things, Friday - but I think you're pretty close or right on the nail about everything.

I nearly threw a persimmon at the screen when Doctor Dino wasn't with Undyne, though. WHAT IS THIS SHIT SCREECH - but then I started paying attention. The relation between Toriel (who seems even stricter, and, whew, more pious then I am... You don't need to go to church... Every day, Toriel...) and DadGoat seems a bit worse, too? I mean, she's throwing his flowers in the trash, yikes...

Not sure how I feel about more swearing, actually. I busted a gut when not!glamrobot cardwizard was all... "GOD DAMNIT" and fled and Susie... can say whatever she wants, my heart... But, sometimes it felt a bit like 'THIS ISN'T YER KIDDY UNDERTALE KID' - on the other hand, it sure helped make the setting feel distinct.

Something about the piano seemed to be recurring. Not just about the 'we're taking control' thing, but I think it might be tied to the elevator prisoner? Sorry, I'm not really a good theorist...

Mmn, for what it's worth though, I don't think that this has anything to do with mainline Undertale; or rather, it seems more like it'll end up dealing with it from a really weird perspective. Like - I almost wonder if it's from Asriel's point of view, or something he's creating to keep going? I really should've tried to solve the key puzzle, but I had one family of two trick-r-treaters! I've never been so happy, they weren't scared by my scary butcher 'costume' even, and I always love seeing kids out with their parents nearby. Uh, what else...

Given that this is a free 'game' demo and I would've loved it even going in blind to Undertale, uh, damn.


OH AND THAT'S NOT COUNTING GUYS, DID YOU HEAR THE SECRET OF EVERMORE SOUNDFONT SAMPLES?! A, aaaaah, that's another old favourite! Sorry, sorry, just - right in the heartmeat!
Okay, lesser non-spoiler-y spoilers that'll still be spoilered for those wanting to get everything for themselves.

(Note to self, list + spoiler doesn't work. Wah...
[*]The lockers in the school are hilarious. Go look at them in ascending order.
[*]Lancer's design annoyed me at first, but by the end, I got a really sympathetic Pokey vibe from him. Lad has a bad dad, which is sad.
[*]Oh, actually... Did anyone else get kind of a Neverending Story vibe from this chapter?
[*].... fuck... susie is so.........
[*]At first I thought we were Megaten, ahaha.
[*]If nobody else knows what I'm talking about with the key thing, it's the ???? prison in the elevator. You have to backtrack a bit.
[*]The puzzle piece tutorial dudes... I felt them. Especially 5-o-clock-shadow piece. Poor bastard!
[*]Did anyone else notice the little text fluff when you give people items? Plus, if you give Ralsei the very first equippable - aaaa...
[*]And Susie has to admit that the chain is cool. I love this game. I love these characters.
[*]One last thing worth noting, maybe a bit more serious; Noelle seems a little concerned about her mother - maybe parental distance is a theme in this one, like losing a kid/sibling was in the first?
[*]hmn, I should arrange for a memorial bench when I kick it. I'd like people to be able to see something like 'love flowers... or DIE' as my last hurrah...[/list]


Edit'd -

zaratustra wrote:characters please stop calling me out for going into literally every room and talking to literally everyone


This, only in real life as well.

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Friday
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Re: Undertale

Postby Friday » Thu Nov 01, 2018 1:59 am

Re: Key Fragments

They're for an optional super boss. Far as anyone can tell, it doesn't affect the main story or any dialog if you clear it.
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Defenestration
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Re: Undertale

Postby Defenestration » Thu Nov 01, 2018 7:59 am

Finished Deltarune in one sitting.

thoughts: Man, I have never been so triggered installing a piece of software from a trustworthy source. That goddamn license agreement...

Re: Ending of currently available download

I was initially angry at the ending. As soon as "Kris" rolls out of bed in a stilted stagger I was literally shouting at my screen. "No Chara, FUCK YOU! You put that RIGHT BACK in your FUCKING CHEST! I never genocided! This is HORESHIT!"

...And then I remembered. I know why none of us have a choice.


(timestamped spoiler as fuck for original UT link) https://youtu.be/gX4GyB375JY?t=13

When I first was watching someone play through a genocide because I couldn't bear the action thought of raising a hand against, frankly, ANY of the bosses, this scene caught me cold. My gut sank into the lithosphere. I closed the twitch stream I had going immediately, and stared at the ceiling for an hour. I couldn't look further into the game for a week.

But my curiousity for this incredible thing I loved overcame my guilt, and I finished watching it. I did stop watching once again due to guilt trip by Sans. (After all the context he narrates, the post-dunk "if we're really friends... you won't come back" was a dagger of ice plunged directly into my heart)

But I still watched it to its end eventually. I still sold my soul, and not even first hand. And why? I love Undertale, so I have to know everything? Because, as stated before, the incredibly petty reason of "But I have to know what HAPPENS to all these characters I adore if they're murdered one by one." I'm reminded of a conversation of just today where I mentioned that I was disgusted with people who are enamored with the nuke option in Fallout 76 and how it's a sign that our culture has become so desensatized to impersonal violence that we're closer than I like to the proxy wars playing like reality tv in Fahrenheit 451 (or you know, any modern american war in the middle east).


I'm still corrupted. And so are you. I guess that's how I know it's a tobyfox game. That unique feeling of self realization, hypocrisy, and personal horror bleeding into my soul.


Toby, you created the most emotionally affecting pieces of media I've consumed in a decade in fucking Gamemaker. Please let me give you more money.

I'm going to bed while very, very sad now.
Una salus victis nullam sperare salutem

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Friday
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Re: Undertale

Postby Friday » Thu Nov 01, 2018 9:23 am

Yeah, everyone did Genocide. There does not exist a single Undertale veteran who hasn't "done" the Genocide route.

Alternatively, if it makes you feel better, you can imagine Chara is a dormant sleeping entity inside of Frisk/You who inevitably comes along for the ride wherever we go, because, you know, she does. Chara isn't just with us when we play Undertale, she's with us in any game we play. That urge to kill everyone in any game that lets us do so "just to see what happens" isn't unique to Undertale, after all.
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Z%rø
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Re: Undertale

Postby Z%rø » Thu Nov 01, 2018 1:06 pm

Spoilers, obviously: Soundtrack is up and for sale. Track names contain some interesting things.
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mharr
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Re: Undertale

Postby mharr » Thu Nov 01, 2018 2:49 pm

Regarding things that don't affect things as far as anyone can tell: In this chapter, anyway.

Man, Toby must have been so pleased to have this done and ready for release on Hallow-e'en. And finding that uninstaller bug was his personal heart attack horror. Damn well serves him right. :D

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Z%rø
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Re: Undertale

Postby Z%rø » Thu Nov 01, 2018 3:03 pm

Alternatively:It's on purpose and he is just warning people.
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zaratustra
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Re: Undertale

Postby zaratustra » Thu Nov 01, 2018 3:52 pm

needed help to realize what Ralsei is an anagram of

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Z%rø
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Re: Undertale

Postby Z%rø » Thu Nov 01, 2018 5:32 pm

Yeah I dumbed up all of those. Even the title of the fucking game.

Anyway I'm making an attempt not to get too deep an obsessed, but the one thing I'll contribute is:

I don't think it's Chara. I think Kris is its own entity. You (The Heart) are put into the vessel(Kris), Overwrite their SAVE, and people are constantly commenting that it's not like Kris. Given the opportunity, Kris rips you out to get himself back.

I'm mostly left wondering about the bloodstain next to the cage. Monsters basically comment that only humans have blood, so why is that here? Has this happened more than once?

I'm waiting for some sort of cross-connection to be made. Something like.. Running both games at once. Or getting to a certain point and switching over. Or copy-pasting a save. Something utterly wacky and unexpected.
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beatbandito
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Re: Undertale

Postby beatbandito » Thu Nov 01, 2018 8:51 pm

this was fun

don't push yourself to beat it in one go, I put 7 hours into it and am glad I didn't rush through any part

I don't think it cares about any other saves
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Maximillian
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Re: Undertale

Postby Maximillian » Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:18 pm

Dammit Toby you're making me experience feelings again.

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Defenestration
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Re: Undertale

Postby Defenestration » Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:16 am

Friday wrote:Alternatively, if it makes you feel better, you can imagine Chara is a dormant sleeping entity inside of Frisk/You who inevitably comes along for the ride wherever we go, because, you know, she does. Chara isn't just with us when we play Undertale, she's with us in any game we play. That urge to kill everyone in any game that lets us do so "just to see what happens" isn't unique to Undertale, after all.

HOW IS THIS SUPPOSED TO MAKE ANYONE FEEL BETTER
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Newbie
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Re: Undertale

Postby Newbie » Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:10 am

Toby posted some thoughts on Chapter 1 to answer a bunch of anticipated questions.

Most important takeaways are that the game has effectively 0% completion for Chapters 2-X and thus will not likely be available any time soon, that this isn't really a prequel or sequel so much as it is a new story that just happens to use the same characters, and that this game is probably impossible for him to make without actually putting together a team.
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beatbandito
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Re: Undertale

Postby beatbandito » Fri Nov 02, 2018 8:48 am

with Zara "Howling Mad" Tustra
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Friday
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Re: Undertale

Postby Friday » Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:21 am

And Fri "the game is now literally impossibly difficult" day
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