War. War never changes. (Except when it does)

[beatbandito]

I know someone posted about Ayman Mohyeldin getting pulled from Gaza, but I can't find which thread that was in.

Anyway, He's back. My inner conspiracist says he either got some new marching orders about what to do/say, or whatever super bad war crimes Israel was commiting are mostly over.

[zaratustra]

- Israel is launching flechette shells - essentially self-propelled claymore mines - on civilian centers

- Israeli minister accuses Hamas of 'self-genociding' by placing missile launchers in populated areas

So, basically, Hamas sends a couple of missiles at Israel, Israel counters with excessive force because it's Israel, and there go another thousand civilians.

[Büge]

Israeli minister accuses Hamas of 'self-genociding' by placing missile launchers in populated areas

So Israel's an abusive husband.

[Brantly B.]

Stop massacring yourself, stop massacring yourself, stop massacring yourself.

[Büge]

I’m telling you, I’m talking about them, I’m not talking about what we can do or not do. I’m telling you what they live in. This is the only thing that deters a suicide bomber. If he knows that when he pulls the trigger, or blows himself up, his sister will be raped. That’s it. That’s the only thing that will bring him back home, to keep the honor of his sister. This is the culture of the Middle East. I didn’t create it, but this is the situation.

This is what an Israeli scholar said about "Middle Eastern Culture".

[Blossom]

Oh for fuck's fuck.

[Mongrel]

The current ceasefire proposed by the US:

1. A one-week, temporary cease-fire, starting Sunday, during which Israel Defense Forces troops will not leave the Gaza Strip entirely and will continue to locate and destroy Hamas tunnels.

2. During this cease-fire, Israel and Hamas will begin negotiations on a more permanent arrangement, with Egyptian mediation. The Palestinian Authority will participate in these talks.

3. The United States, the UN secretary-general and the European Union will provide guarantees to both sides that the negotiations will deal with the issues important to them – for Israel, disarming Gaza of its rockets and tunnels, and for Hamas, ending the blockade of Gaza and repairing the damage the Strip has suffered.

So, if I read this correctly, this would be a "ceasefire" where Hamas stops attacking and the IDF remains in Gaza and is still permitted to 'locate and destroy tunnels', which as a friend pointed out "based on past experience seems to involve blowing up a lot of houses".

Good job Kerry. No wait, go fuck yourself.

[Blossom]

And yet, as weak and ineffectual as that would be, it's still an unacceptable obstacle to Israel's genocide campaign, so of course they've rejected it.

[Mongrel]

Yep! As being pro-Hamas!

[Mongrel]

An Israeli professor of Middle Eastern studies weighs in with a "reasonable" solution

Where "reasonable" is a step or two short of "final".

Oh but wait! They've already gone there!

Check out the demands from the Deputy Speaker of the Knesset:

Ultimatum – One warning from the Prime Minister of Israel to the enemy population, in which he announces that Israel is about to attack military targets in their area and urges those who are not involved and do not wish to be harmed to leave immediately. Sinai is not far from Gaza and they can leave. This will be the limit of Israel’s humanitarian efforts. Hamas may unconditionally surrender and prevent the attack.

Attack – Attack the entire ‘target bank’ throughout Gaza with the IDF’s maximum force (and not a tiny fraction of it) with all the conventional means at its disposal. All the military and infrastructural targets will be attacked with no consideration for ‘human shields’ or ‘environmental damage’. It is enough that we are hitting exact targets and that we gave them advance warning.

Siege – Parallel to the above, a total siege on Gaza. Nothing will enter the area. Israel, however, will allow exit from Gaza. (Civilians may go to Sinai, fighters may surrender to IDF forces).

Defense – Any place from which Israel or Israel’s forces were attacked will be immediately attacked with full force and no consideration for ‘human shields’ or ‘environmental damage’.

Conquer – After the IDF completes the "softening" of the targets with its fire-power, the IDF will conquer the entire Gaza, using all the means necessary to minimize any harm to our soldiers, with no other considerations.

Elimination- The GSS and IDF will thoroughly eliminate all armed enemies from Gaza. The enemy population that is innocent of wrong-doing and separated itself from the armed terrorists will be treated in accordance with international law and will be allowed to leave. Israel will generously aid those who wish to leave.

Sovereignty – Gaza is part of our Land and we will remain there forever. Liberation of parts of our land forever is the only thing that justifies endangering our soldiers in battle to capture land. Subsequent to the elimination of terror from Gaza, it will become part of sovereign Israel and will be populated by Jews. This will also serve to ease the housing crisis in Israel. The coastal train line will be extended, as soon as possible, to reach the entire length of Gaza.

According to polls, most of the Arabs in Gaza wish to leave. Those who were not involved in anti-Israel activity will be offered a generous international emigration package. Those who choose to remain will receive permanent resident status. After a number of years of living in Israel and becoming accustomed to it, contingent on appropriate legislation in the Knesset and the authorization of the Minister of Interior, those who personally accept upon themselves Israel’s rule, substance and way of life of the Jewish State in its Land, will be offered Israeli citizenship.

Edit:

It's ghoulish watching this unfold, in a way, following the roots of hatred back decades. It's easy to imagine you are looking at nothing more than dry history, something our grandparents experienced but from which we were spared. Until you see the hand of the nazis reaching out and touching not just our grandparents, but us today, and not in the crudely comical imitation forms like Illinois nazis, but a hatred which morphed to take on a new form when the Israelis gazed into that abyss.

For a few years now, my stated position on the Palestinian situation has been that "The actions of the State of Israel have done greater harm to the Jewish faith and done more to foster the cause of antisemitism than any human act since the end of the Second World War.

The participants in the Wannsee conference may be long dead, but they must be laughing in their graves. No amount of planning on their part could have given their successors a gift so perfect. "See? See what happens when you give them a state?!"

[Mongrel]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/ ... ttle-video

Residents of Gaza City gather leaflets dropped into the streets by the Israeli military on Monday. Thousands of pieces of white paper listed the names of members of Hamas and its allies whom Israel claims to have killed since its offensive began. The leaflets say that the names listed are "those who thought they could face the might of the Israeli Defence Forces"

Is the IDF run by Aku?

[Smiler]

Yes.

[Friday]

LONG AGO IN A DISTANT LAND, I, THE JEWS, WERE HERDED INTO CAMPS AND KILLED BY THE MILLIONS. SO THE WORLD UNLEASHED AN UNSPEAKABLE SOVEREIGN STATE, BUT SOME FOOLISH ARAB WARRIORS, WIELDING SUICIDE BOMBERS, STEPPED FORTH TO OPPOSE ME.

*Explosion sounds*

*Explosion sounds*

*Screaming*

[Sharkey]

I've said it before, but at this point Israel is pretty much the Ur-Quan.

After our genocide and/or enslavement we've decided to genocide and/or enslave everyone to keep that from happening again.

[Mongrel]

Okay, so today in "Really bad news" Hamas killed two Israeli soldiers and kidnapped a third at the beginning of the most recent attempt at a 72-hour ceasefire. Because Hamas command-and-control is poor at best (a state of affairs that may or may not have been a desired goal of Israel, but that's a much longer post), this is almost certainly a case of the lower-ranked dudes doing a thing and then the leadership taking solidarity with them because bros before jews, but Hamas PR has been godawfully shitty on this (they keep changing their reason/excuses), so any hope for short term peace just got shelled to fuck and then some.

And then there was this link. It's down because it was pulled mere seconds after being posted. But man OH man, check out that URL: http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/when-gen ... rmissible/

[Smiler]

Here's the full article. It almost looks like satire but then again the dude is defending it on twitter.

The ceasefire was kind of a joke anyways because it still allowed for Israel to blow stuff up to look for tunnels, so its not like they weren't going to find some hamas dudes to start shooting at them in 72 hours.

[Büge]

Well, Falselogic on Talking Time was nice(?) enough to have linked it as a picture.

https://i.imgur.com/JLZg30t.png

[Blossom]

Don't worry, the author's father's paper still has it in full. Neeeevermind, it's gone from there too.

[sei]

And then there was this link. It's down because it was pulled mere seconds after being posted. But man OH man, check out that URL: http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/when-gen ... rmissible/

Here's the full article.

When Genocide is Permissible as a web page.

Salient excerpts (but go read the whole thing; it's short).

We are at war with an enemy whose charter calls for the annihilation of our people. Nothing, then, can be considered disproportionate when we are fighting for our very right to live.
...
there’s going to have to come a time where Israel feels threatened enough where it has no other choice but to defy international warnings – because this is life or death.
...
Most of the reports coming from Gazan officials and leaders since the start of this operation have been either largely exaggerated or patently false. The truth is, it’s not their fault, falsehood and deceit is part of the very fabric of who they are and that will never change.
...
Hamas has stated forthrightly that it idealizes death as much as Israel celebrates life. What other way then is there to deal with an enemy of this nature other than obliterate them completely?
...
If political leaders and military experts determine that the only way to achieve its goal of sustaining quiet is through genocide is it then permissible to achieve those responsible goals?

There's a reason this thing got pulled. I don't think it's fair to attribute his view to that of the state, its people, and maybe even not the printing newspaper, given the retraction.

[Mongrel]

I don't think I'd hold the Times of Israel responsible for the article per se; it's pretty clear it's only an affiliated blog (i.e. not even an official columnist, though perhaps that distinction isn't very significant) and they DID pull the page about as fast as anyone can in the internet age (hint: no matter how fast, this is always too slow).

Though if I was the EIC or owner I might want to flog the Opinion Editor up and down the street for letting yahoos like that post under the auspices of the official site in the first place.