Boomers: An analysis

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Friday
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Boomers: An analysis

Postby Friday » Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:03 pm

hi, Friday here, age Millennials, and I'm here to kill Applebees chew bubblegum, but I'm all out of bubblegum, because I can't afford bubblegum talk about the basic (general) structural psychological differences between the Boomers and the current generation.

I am of course inviting dissent to my ideas by posting here, and that's what I want. If you disagree with my analysis, say so, and maybe I'll learn something! Or maybe you'll learn something! Discussion!

So, without further delay, lets talk about everyone's favorite generation that is being blamed for the downfall of civilization, the Millennials Boomers!

So I won't waste your time. The most fundamental difference between Boomers and younger generations (especially Millennials) is that

Boomers are fundamentally trusting

and

Millennials are not.

What do I mean by this? Well, I've come to this conclusion after observing a lot of data over the course of my life. I'm going to give some anecdotes, but I think after you read them you will agree that they're not "rare" in any sense and can probably be safely broad stroke painted.

So, what do I mean by fundamentally trusting? Well, I mean it literally. At least literally when it comes to listening to other people, especially (but not limited to) authority. (And by authority I include "corporations.")

It's not complicated. A Boomer who is told something tends to believe that to be true without needing a citation. A Millennial who hears something tends to want a citation.

This is, of course, not a 100% thing and there are exceptions. ALSO

ALSO

I'M NOT INCLUDING IDENTITY CONFLICTING INFORMATION

WHICH BOTH GENERATIONS

IN FACT ALL GENERATIONS

WILL AUTOMATICALLY DISBELIEVE WHEN TOLD, AND EVEN CONTINUE TO DISBELIEVE AFTER PROOF IS SHOWN.

I want to be clear on this point so it's not brought up later. A piece of information given by any other source, person, wikipedia, employer, the government, whatever, it doesn't matter, that attacks a person's identity will be automatically disregarded and distrusted. Even, as I said before, when factual proof is offered.

If you don't know the difference between new information that attacks a person's core identity and new information that doesn't, well.

The easy go-to example is religion, but political alignment is also easy. Any information that attacks a person's core beliefs in those two things (and a person's identity is not just their religious beliefs or their political leanings, but those are probably the two most famous, or infamous, examples) will be rejected, and not uncommonly violently so.

So please don't post later saying "but Friday young republicans don't trust me when I tell them that the party they've decided to align themselves with (and self-identify with) is actually a bunch of racist homophobes!"

Okay. That's out of the way, hopefully, so I can get to the meat of what I'm talking about.

Right. Trust.

Let's examine why Boomers trust people when people tell them things.

PART ONE OF FIVE HUNDRED AND TWENTY SEVEN: WHY BOOMERS FALL FOR FUCKING SCAMS

"Because they're not tech-savvy!"

Yes, that is a factor. And yes, young people/applebee slayers also fall for scams, both of the "send out a shitload on the net and get 5 hits" and "guy sells you a watch" variety. Again, again, again. I am not saying my assertion is a 100% always the case. But anyone here who has a living parent can probably attest to the fact that they have had to listen to said parent ask them if "the guy who called me and wanted my social security number, my bank number, my pin code, my blood type, my firstborn child, the key to my front door, my stereo, remote access to my computer, my true name that when uttered in my presence allows you to give me commands, up to and including murder, suicide, ritual self-cannibalization, and clucking like a chicken for 10 GP, and also my wallet with all of my money in it" was a scam.

"Yeah, mom. That's probably a scam. You know how I can tell? They called you. General rule of thumb: If someone calls you and wants your stereo, it's a scam."

"Okay thanks honey, I wasn't sure despite all the spelling mistakes in his voice and the very loud droning noise in the background that made blood come out of my forehead like in the Fifth Element when Darkness talks to Zorg."

"No problem, mom. By the way, every time you pick up the phone, it flags you as an 'active number' that only invites more calls, so if you don't recognize the number, don't pick up. And also they can mask their numbers to appear as coming from our town, and also even as numbers that are familiar to you, so... yeah don't pick up your phone."

"Okay honey, thanks!"

3 seconds pass

"Friday, this man just called and I picked up and he says I need to give him my kidneys, liver, brain, heart, lungs, feet, fingers, teeth, and stereo. Is this a scam?"

"Mom, what did I just say about stereos?"

"Oh right, sorry honey."

Boomers fall for scams, not because they're more stupid than Dryer Sheet Slayers, but because they are more inclined to trust a person when that person says "give me money." Or when that person tells them anything else.

But why?

My theory is this: Boomers grew up in an era where you could, generally, trust other people at their word.

BUT FRIDAY

yes I fucking KNOW that even in the 60s there were confidence scams, okay? I'm not an idiot. (Well okay I am but I do know there were confidence scams in the 60s.) But I do actually believe that, back then, before the invention of THE WORLD WIDE WEB OF LIES, CONSTANT LIES, NOTHING BUT LIES, EVERY EMAIL YOU GET IS A FUCKING LIE THAT WILL BLEED YOU DRY, EVEN VIDEO GAMES ARE A LIE NOW DESIGNED TO SUCK YOU DRY, that you could trust people.

"Go to college and you'll get a good job."

Boomers: "Okay!" *does so, gets better job* "Wow, that worked! Cool! I guess I'll learn to trust what my parents and society says!"

People who simultaneously do and do not have enough sex: "Okay!" *does so, gets a lifetime of endless debt, does not get a better job* "Wow, this videogame is preying on my loss aversion and/or my love of gambling to try to milk me for cash!"

(White) Boomers grew up in a world where they were told if they worked hard, went to college, and paid into the system, the system would pay them back. And it did. They learned to trust the system because the system treated them fairly.

People who iphones have ruined forever, permanently crippling their social abilities because they're like, always looking at their phones and texting grew up in a world where they were told if they worked hard, went to college, and paid into the system, the system would pay them back. And it didn't. Instead the system laughed and skated out of the room with all their time and money. The learned to distrust the system, and by extension, the people in that system.

A friend of mine told me about his mom trusting Elon Musk to "know something we didn't" when he called that guy a pedophile on twitter.

Haha, what?!

WHAT?!

But this is normal for that mom. Elon Musk is an authority figure to her because he's so cool and has a lot of money and a spaceship company. Authority figures are to be trusted. People are to be trusted. They told me things and those things turned out to be true. Why would a person lie when I have had a life experience that reinforced that trusting other people leads me to good outcomes?

And yes of course there are going to be counter examples in young people. But the Boomers specifically are the bleating, trusting sheep that directly finance Nigeria entirely.

Friday is this post sour grapes? Do you wish you got the same sweet deal the Boomers did?

Well, yes of course I do? The fuck question is that? No, no, I wish student debt would increase. I love it when I can only afford top fucking ramen! It builds character! I want actual lava to pour into my house on the reg!

As for the sour grapes thing, not really. I mean, shit, if growing up with that same sweet deal led me to becoming a bleating, sheeplike idiot that can do nothing but complain about the youths on my lawn and give money to scammers, then no fucking thanks. I just want to have a discussion about the reasons behind why Boomers be like this and us Killers of All We Survey be like this. And I really do think it's a fundamental disparity in how we view information.

A Boomer views all new information as true until disproven, and we view it as false until proven. Excepting identity challenging information, which both (all) generations view as false, even after proven.

And yeah, there are other reasons that we're different. But I think my theory is possibly the most important fundamental divide.

I mean, try it for yourself. Go up to your friends your own age, people who trust you, and tell them something outlandish. See if they believe you, or if they want you to prove it. Then go up to your mom or dad, who trust you, and tell them the same thing.

See if that Boomer says "citation needed."
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Mongrel
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Mongrel » Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:34 pm

The thing to remember is that not trusting people was the norm before. We're just falling backwards.

The Boomers grew up in such a novel era where you could trust people because the "Greatest Generation" made sacrifices on an epochal scale to try and better the world, after living through possibly the most horrible era the world had seen since the fucking Black Plague. For the most part, they demanded and tried to be qualified, competent leaders, fair judges, diligent scientists, ethical doctors, etc. because they had been through the living hell of all living hells.

Only not everyone is good - I know you and I have been on the same "People are not inherently good" page on that for a long time Friday - and so, in an era of trust, there were still those who preyed on fears, who didn't (and don't) give a damn if society fell, so long as they got a bigger chunk of the rubble. Maybe they had to wait a few decades, but they never stopped scheming, never stopped learning and adapting. And now they're back, baby. Oh are they ever back. Nixon cracked the Unholy Seal and Reagan/Thatcher blew the lid off, and it's only been worse since then.

It's a little thing, but one of the most AMAZING things to come out of the era of GG leadership are those little instructional movies (mostly American) to encourage people to not discriminate, to not fall for people trying to use divisions of class or race to scam others. That there was this drive to actually educate people on how not to be victimized by villains and assholes, by false leaders and snake oil salesmen. It's amazing! Like straight up FUCKING AMAZING to think that any human society had reached that point ever, let alone within living memory.

But we got a little trusting, we got a little lax. You might even argue that maybe boomers were a little coddled by the GG, a scarred and traumatized generation that lived in terror of their children experiencing even half the hardships they did.

So here we are, The Evil That Men Do, etc. etc. So yeah, I agree.
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Mongrel » Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:40 pm

Oh and, obligatory reminder that this discussion is really only relevant to the Western World and even then probably only the white part. At least directly. The whole world is suffering the consequences now, only some parts never stopped suffering at all.

Which, I'm pretty sure most of you know, but just saying.
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Brentai » Tue Aug 20, 2019 7:01 pm

Generation X continues to sit on the side benches, wondering how they let their children steal away the future that their parents were hoarding.
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Newbie » Tue Aug 20, 2019 7:09 pm

Julie joined a facebook group in which they all pretend to be boomers. I'm having a hard time thinking of something more millenial than that.
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby beatbandito » Tue Aug 20, 2019 7:14 pm

vegan boomer themed potlucks
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby nosimpleway » Tue Aug 20, 2019 7:25 pm

Genom corporation is all "we have these machines that are absolutely safe and absolutely will not go berserk and start killing people" and the young people are like "yeah, whatever" but old people buy them for basic labor jobs and stuff until they go berserk and start killing people

then the young people (who have not been killed by berserk robots) start calling the robots the worst name they can think of, previously assigned to the trusting rubes who bought them in the first place

"Boomers"

This will happen by 2032, right after the Great Kanto Earthquake rips Tokyo literally in half

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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Grath » Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:02 pm

but Friday young republicans don't trust me when I tell them that the party they've decided to align themselves with (and self-identify with) is actually a bunch of racist homophobes!

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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Friday » Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:39 pm

Grath is actually the only person here who can out-shitpost me
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Brentai » Wed Aug 21, 2019 5:50 pm

Which is good, because if he in-shitposted you, you'd explode.
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Thad » Wed Aug 21, 2019 6:50 pm

I think there's something to this; it seems like I linked a Charles Stross article, ages ago, to the effect that Boomers still believe in the American Dream because they benefited from it, while Millennials don't because they haven't.

Of course, that comes with a load of caveats, as any generalization should. You've already noted the racial and geographical assumptions we make when we generalize about Boomers. And of course part of this is that *every* generation calls its parents out-of-touch and its children soft and entitled.

As for falling for scams, I'm not sure that's as directly pertinent an issue as you're implying; there's pretty good research to indicate that's just cognitive decline. It's not a matter of being more trusting by nature, it's a matter of slowly losing the ability to make good decisions. So that's something to look forward to.

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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Brentai » Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:25 pm

A long time ago I came to the conclusion that it's not just Millennials that don't believe in the American dream; if you look at just about the entirety of human history, the concept of everybody being entitled to living fully independent of their families, supporting a population-increasing number of children and having access to certain guaranteed largish luxury items (in particular, a single-occupant automobile) is something that would only be even imaginable to a certain population of postwar xth-generation Americans, and maybe some beneficiaries of other empirical booms in history (most of the Chinese are still pining for the heady days of the Eastern Han Dynasty). Our generation isn't disadvantaged; our generation is perfectly normal and is burdened by the expectation of those that spent their entire lives in Wonderland. Also, we didn't breathe a lifetime's worth of leaded gasoline exhaust, so there's that.

In Roman terms, Boomers lived the reign of Augustus and we're stuck living the reign of Caligula, which *glances eastward* checks out. Gen X of course had to put up with the uncertain reign of Tiberius. We've still got two generations before things go full-on Nero, so if you end up having grandchildren, make sure you be extra nice to them.
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Büge » Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:39 pm

Brentai wrote:In Roman terms, Boomers lived the reign of Augustus and we're stuck living the reign of Caligula, which *glances eastward* checks out. Gen X of course had to put up with the uncertain reign of Tiberius. We've still got two generations before things go full-on Nero, so if you end up having grandchildren, make sure you be extra nice to them.


Are you sure? I mean, wasn't Obama your Claudius?
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby mharr » Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:08 am

Maybe it's always the same deck, but they get shuffled for each new era?

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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby zaratustra » Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:25 am

Brentai wrote:Generation X continues to sit on the side benches, wondering how they let their children steal away the future that their parents were hoarding.


It doesn't help that Generation X is *tiny*. If you take Boomers to be 1945-1965 and Millenials to be 1980-2000, that's 15 years of low birth rates compared to 20 years of high birth rates for the other two.

Brentai wrote:Our generation isn't disadvantaged; our generation is perfectly normal and is burdened by the expectation of those that spent their entire lives in Wonderland..


Until about 2000 there was this illusion that all this growth was cumulative; that each new generation would be fully furnished with everything previous generations enjoyed. This backfired when it turned out it involved the previous generations handing it out.

By the way? Something that surprised me.

The oldest Boomers are 75 years old. Trump, Murdoch and McConnell are *not* boomers. They're from the

*pfft*

Silent Generation. yeah fuck off.

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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Brentai » Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:43 pm

I feel like a lot of economic assumptions are based on people past the age of 67 not having access to affordable life-extending medical care. Clearly social security has fucked us all over and that's why we shouldn't let Millennials have it! :awesomeface:
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Mongrel » Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:18 pm

mharr wrote:Maybe it's always the same deck, but they get shuffled for each new era?

I'm fond of the Mark Twain quote to the effect that "History does not in fact repeat itself. It does however rhyme a lot."
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Brentai » Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:27 pm

Motion to shorten this topic name to "Boom: Anal".
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Friday » Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:46 pm

Snipin's a good job mait
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Re: Boomers: An analysis

Postby Mothra » Fri Aug 23, 2019 9:46 am

The CEO of my company is a boomer, really really wants to be joined at the hip with the company, be included in everything, take part in all important discussions, etc. We all use Slack for absolutely all discussion inside the company. He refuses to learn how to use Slack. It's maybe the most boomer thing I've seen in years - the key to doing the exact thing he desperately wants to do is right in front of him, in the most accessible format imaginable, and all he need do is spend one day learning how to use it.

Simply a bridge too far.

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