Trump Leaving Office Poll (Part 2)

[Thad]

Not to pile on but yeah, like I was saying yesterday I've been wrong often enough that I try to be a little more humble about predictions than I used to be.

I was talking about my mixed feelings about Robert Anton Wilson over in the conspiracy theories thread the other day, too. But one extremely valuable psycholinguistic point he made that's stuck with me is the importance of qualifiers like "I think" and "it seems". They help keep perspective, and they're an acknowledgement to myself and others that there's always a chance I might be full of shit. Which helps make me look less of a fool on the occasions when it turns out that I am full of shit.

Not for nothin', though? Times I've been wrong include discussions we had years ago where I said the cops weren't really as bad as you were saying they were. The last few years (not just the Trump Administration but everything leading up to it) have shown you had a much clearer understanding of the threat of fascism and the role of the police in same than I did. So while I think it's healthy to acknowledge you could be wrong, I'd be a fool at this point not to acknowledge that you could be right.

[KingRoyal]

Yes, yes, I think there's a fascist coup coming. You'll forgive me for shirking on those in my sentences, but you are right, these are just my thoughts and feelings based upon what I know. But there's absolutely zero reason to believe that fascism can't claim power here. It's not like flipping a switch, where suddenly things go from liberal democracy to fascist police state over night. It's full of years of street conflict, aborted attempts to seize power, and a political class that refuses to confront fascism head on.

History doesn't follow a script we can neatly refer to, but it does have some patterns. And nation turning to fascism after a devastating national tragedy and a severe global economic collapse? That's a bit too close for comfort.

[Friday]

Hitler led an unsuccessful coup in 1923, went to prison for nine months and finally achieved power in 1933. The history of the rise of fascism in Europe both before WWII and after has a pretty clear pattern of the movement attempting shit like this before they finally succeed. The Black Shirts in Italy tried for years before Mussolini seized power, same with Franco in Spain. No amount of underestimating what the American fascist movement is capable of has actually stopped or slowed Trump down, and those in the movement clearly aren't going to back down and even the elected officials who support him didn't stop.

There is absolutely no reason to believe that Trump has finally been vanquished, especially when the Democrats are pretty clear they don't intend to really do anything.

I'm not saying this to be pessimistic. I'm saying this because the attitude of "It can't happen here" is how it happens, and I have zero reason to believe that our elected officials are going to do anything about it. Even Thad's appraisal of the situation is "Yeah, Merrick Garland can if he wants to," followed by a comparison to Mueller, who was completely ineffectual.

I mean, I agree with most of this, especially how much I despise the people who take that "It can't happen here" attitude. I just object to the implied assertion that there's "no chance" we can't avert what you're outlining. I get in this conversation with beatbandito and MetalSlime in finalfight too. Like I said, I don't blame anyone who can't see a way forward other than darkness, not after 2020.

Again, I do not for a MICROSECOND even remotely believe "it can't happen here." I just believe it doesn't have to. I mean, we're posting in a thread that has a poll, at the top, made by me, that is directly implying that "3. other" is very very bad.

Yes, yes, I think there's a fascist coup coming.

Uh, no. The fascist coup has been in progress since Trump started his election fraud rhetoric and tried to gut the USPS. Yesterday was just another step. (I get what you mean, I just think it's important to be clear that Trump is already actively engaged in a coup.)

[KingRoyal]

I do want to clarify because it looks like I must have left it out, I don't think there's "no chance" we can't avert it. I'm saying do not have faith in the Democrats to do it. And this isn't my usual, languid "I hate the Democrats" stuff, it's because, well, are they actively doing anything right now? Because they seem like they just want to ignore it. And, it just really feels like politicians, from local all the way up to federal, are terrified of the police. That has me really worried.

The point I'm trying to make is if we want to avoid this, the American political system ain't gonna do it. It's gonna take organization and confrontation.

[beatbandito]

not embedding a tweet of four videos showing Ashli Babbit being killed.

It's pretty much what I figured, not the exact location I thought it was. But one of the suited cops that protects the congress members was clearly threatening to shoot if she continued to break through a window to access where they were staying bunkered.

She doesn't, he shoots.

The uniformed cops that had been just escorting the chuds around up to that point temporarily responds as if there's an active shooter, but immediately confirms it's another cop that took the shot and relaxes. It looks like pretty much everyone else in the area backs away and I imagine the more heavily armed cops started blocking that entry to prevent more shootings.

[Mongrel]

Oh, speaking of Nazi imagery (from your request yesterday, Friday).

I still don't see any actual Nazi flags, so it looks like that claim was indeed being made using pictures from past right-wing rallies, but it's worth pointing out that Q ManBearPig's* chest has a huge neo-nazi tat right over his heart, the one with the triangles.

The three linked triangles are known as a "Valknot"

The Valknot or "knot of the slain" is an old Norse symbol associated with the afterlife that has been appropriated by white supremacists as a racist symbol. Nonracist pagans may also use this symbol, so it should be carefully examined in context.

I THINK WE GOT ENOUGH CONTEXT, THANKS.

The others might be similarly "neo-pagan" (riiiiight), but I haven't found any info on them yet. Sun wheels are pretty common in neo-nazi logos though.

*(dude is apparently known as the "Shaman of QAnon" among the looney bin crowd)


EDIT: Bonus comedy round!

I mentioned this in finalfight, but the best part for me was seeing the pictures of the Confederate Battle Flag being flown in the Senate.

Like, what the South tried and failed to do 160 years ago was managed yesterday. It just made me smile.

We spend $750 billion annually on "defense" and the center of American government fell in two hours to the duck dynasty and the guy in the chewbacca bikini

[Mongrel]

More dumb and comedic nonsense: Pence unfollowed Trump on Twitter.

"This'll get me off the hook!"

Even better: For doing so, Q has now added him to their pile of "traitors".

Well, treason it is then @Mike_Pence.

We gave you every opportunity to do the right thing.

[Wheels]

I know I haven't been around much, but it's good to see old faces!

Yeah, this is full on nuts.

But I am petty enough to ask; it's completely clear to you we should immediately punch nazis now, right?

[hngkong]

I know I haven't been around much, but it's good to see old faces!

Yeah, this is full on nuts.

But I am petty enough to ask; it's completely clear to you we should immediately punch nazis now, right?

Edit: Boo! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guVA9nYEjWUb
Punch Em In the Dick

[Friday]

Don't worry Defen, I've been periodically giving him shit on that exact point for the past few years

anyway nice to see you again, even if it's just you here to see us being mad at a coup for a bit

[Brantly B.]

And this isn't my usual, languid "I hate the Democrats" stuff, it's because, well, are they actively doing anything right now? Because they seem like they just want to ignore it. And, it just really feels like politicians, from local all the way up to federal, are terrified of the police.

This is the part I keep getting stuck on.

The take I see from a lot of people is that the Dems will never ever punch back, because they're memetically spineless betas who will not once stand up for themselves, no matter how much power they wield and no matter how much they're directly threatened. And that's... not... really what the neolibs are. They're cowardly and craven enough never to expend any political capital for you, sure, and definitely not for their lower class constituents But do you really, honestly believe that Nancy Patricia Pelosi of all people, who just had her office broken into, who is right now third in the Presidential line of secession, who in 13 days will not answer to a single person not in her party and not sympathetic to her - do you think Face of Uterine Terror Nancy is going to do absolutely nothing because she's oh so meek and timid?

No. The Dems may be spineless, but right now they are spineless, personally aggrieved, and in power. Do you know what spineless people do when they suddenly get the upper hand on the people who wronged them?



Here's the thing. It's going to look like the Obama 2.0 administration isn't doing anything about this because you're not going to see what they're doing, unless of course you decide to go and look.

I know this because this happened this morning, and I could have fucking told you that this exact thing would have happened last night:

Those who massed on Capitol Hill intending to disrupt a joint session of Congress that was certifying Biden’s election victory over Trump “weren’t protesters. Don’t dare call them protesters. They were a riotous mob — insurrectionists, domestic terrorists. It’s that basic,” Biden said.

Well now!

Now that's an over the top bit of rhetoric, isn't it? Surely Joseph R. Biden Jr. does not intend to classify these members of a somewhat out of control mob as actual terrorists, does he? Subject to indefinite detention, enhanced interrogation, and all those things that would be a no-no to do to regular U.S. citizens, who might in this case have gone just a little too far in their angry drunken rioting, right?

Right?

Right.








I fully expect that every identifiable individual in that crowd will be investigated for possible links to "domestic terror" organizations, which in the last four years we've been cutely referring to as militia.

I fully expect that any individual who can be associated with a possible terror organization will be interrogated. In the usual way.

I fully expect that these organizations to be quietly and discreetly taken care of. In the usual way.

I fully expect that none of this will be reported by CNN.

I fully expect that every member of the Capitol Police, whose one job is to keep angry people out of the Capitol, will be investigated. I fully expect the character assassination of any officer who doesn't play nicey-nice to their investigators' faces. I fully expect the organization as a whole to suffer a death by a thousand cuts; budgetary restrictions, training requirements, regulations, writeup after writeup after writeup after writeup. I fully expect them to complain that they're unable to do their job, and I fully expect them to be right. And I fully expect that every failure on their part will just be a smirking, secret victory for the Administration. I fully expect that they will serve as a warning to any other PD that tries to forget that they're nothing more than thugs, badged and stuffed into fancy uniforms by their moral superiors, and kept on a leash that can be pulled on at any time.

Joseph R. Biden Jr. personally made the police what they are today, and there's nothing stopping him right now from unmaking them the exact same way. I fully expect him to remind everybody in this country of that detail.

Of course, none of these things are what you would call "meaningful reforms". All of them are the the typical actions of a group of neoliberal capitalists who just had their power and safety threatened by, to put it bluntly, a herd of puffed-up proletariats. It doesn't take a lot of guts to kick around a mob of financially crippled trash with no real allies when you have access to the most overequipped armed forces in the history of the human race. Once they're satisfied, then it'll be truly back to brunch. But I don't for a second think they're not going to seek out that satisfaction.

Does this make you feel better? That they're probably going to do something, probably a lot of somethings, while most people aren't looking? Does it make you feel worse? I don't think the world really cares about that. It's 2009 again, and the physical limitations of space and time won't let you do anything about it but try to play the ball where it lies.

[KingRoyal]

And I fully expect a solid gold toilet, but it's just not in the cards.

[Brantly B.]

Has anybody ever told you that you are way too optimistic?

[mharr]

It'll be interesting to see if they spend anything on seriously trying to work out why this happened and how to stop it happening again. You don't really want to keep playing Wheel of Insurrection if it can be avoided.

[Brantly B.]

Not too often, but a couple of spins can really reinforce your self-proclaimed mandate.

(NOTE: Before anyone asks, no, if anybody in current power had planned this they would have done it when they were not in session trying to get things done.)

[Grath]

There is absolutely no reason to believe that Trump has finally been vanquished, especially when the Democrats are pretty clear they don't intend to really do anything.

Hitler was in his 30s when he attempted his coup. Trump is a 74-year-old Covid-19 survivor whose diet consists of big macs, diet coke, and adderall, and his exercise routine consists solely of playing golf.

[Metal Slime]

At long last Trump got permanently suspended from Twitter. It's no impeachment or 25th, but to him, it may as well be.

[Blossom]

At least nine years late, and that's probably the extent of any consequence anyone will see. Victory!

[Brantly B.]

I've been waiting for four years to post this clip and today's the day boys and girls:

[Büge]