TNG Episode Tier List

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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Mongrel » Thu Jun 23, 2022 5:19 pm

Basically, the first couple episodes became the first Star Trek movie. It would have just been more of that crew.

Except the twist is that it actually WAS planned as a movie series FIRST (in 1975) and then Paramount figured a sci-fi movie wouldn't fly, so they turned it into a TV series after Close Encounters of the 3rd Kind demonstrated that sci-fi movies could be big money (or, more accurately, non-Star Wars sci-fi films) after all, and then they went back to the original plan for a movie series.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Friday » Sun Jun 26, 2022 1:35 pm

We now move on to Season 3.

Season 3 is where the show really started to hit its stride. The theory goes that the show sucked until Riker grew his beard, but he had his beard in Season 2 and that was a pretty spotty season. Really, it's Season 3, though not immediately, as the first episode at least is sort of a dud.

It's possible that Season 3 is actually the best season. That's how good the show got so fast. And the Season Finale, is, of course, fuckin' legendary.

Let's get this show on the road. The Space Road. Uh. Where we're going we don't need roads?

Engage it so.

Evolution: D Tier

A scientist shows up to complete his life's work but Wesley fucks everything up by falling asleep with an extremely dangerous science experiment (nanites) that start to multiply by eating the ship. The scientist is, shockingly, extremely arrogant, shitty, and rude. I don't know what the fuck was up with TNG's writers. It's a science fiction show so why is every scientist on the fucking show just an unrepentant asshole fuckface?

Said scientist wants to genocide the nanites despite them evolving sentience to fix the ship and complete his work. Picard instead talks to them through Data and the Nanites show that they're better than humans by not holding a grudge against the dipshit scientist who massacred them.

I'd put this in C Tier but at this point if I see another "asshole scientist only cares about his work" I will rip a hole in the fabric of space/time and travel back to the TNG writer's room and... well, I'd probably just join them and get them to do an episode about Air Bud or something.

The Ensigns of Command: A Tier

The infamous "rules lawyer" episode, this plot features a planet illegally settled by humans (their ship crashed a long time ago) that belongs to the "Sheliak Corporate", a race of extremely LAWFUL NEUTRALS that are tentacle creatures under a rug. They consider humans (and most other lifeforms) to be primitive, braying animals in comparison to their massive throbbing LAW BRAINS. So they have no problem with nuking the entire human infested site from orbit, and would be entirely within their rights as dictated by the 10,000 page long treaty that the Federation sent 372 legal experts to hash out.

What does the Enterprise have? Picard, motherfuckers.

Meanwhile, Data beams down to the planet alone because it's got radiation that kills humans, which is why it was given to the Sheliak in the first place. How the humans survived at all is a mystery.

Both plotlines are interesting and well executed, and both climaxes are great. Data shows the people who are reluctant to leave their home because they worked so hard to make it that the Sheliak will simply obliterate them from orbit by demonstrating a fraction of their power by vaporizing their aqueduct with his phaser. this jars them awake to the reality of their situation like a hand on a hot stove and they agree to leave.

Meanwhile, after getting LAW FUCKED by the Sheliak for most of the episode and getting hung up on over and over, Picard finds an obscure clause in the treaty and:



Bonus points for the sub-sub story about Geordi having to do the impossible task of reinventing transporters themselves to be able to cut through the planet's radiation.

The Survivors: A Tier (Bottom)

The Enterprise finds a planet that is completely reduced to ash. Inexplicably there's a patch of land 2 miles square of whatever that is an idyllic well watered lawn with some trees and a nice house on it.

Two old people are living there. Their story doesn't quite add up.

I'll leave off the resolution of the episode since the whole story hinges on it. It's a good episode, if a bit slow. Also Riker gets caught in a snare and hangs upsidown for a bit.

Who Watches The Watchers: C Tier

A team of scientists studying a kind of proto-vulcan people fuck up and pollute the culture when their equipment fails. Then the Enterprise shows up to fix it and further fucks everything up. They start to worship Picard as a god until finally Picard beams up one of the women and shows her the ship and explains what they are. I think this is the episode where the memory wipe tech that Pulaski invented is brought up and handwaved away by saying the proto-vulcan brain is too strong for it or whatever.

A ho-hum episode. No real major flaws and an interesting enough premise and resolution, but nothing stands out.

The Bonding: C Tier

A pretty good story dragged down by a weird plot about an alien who pretends to be a dead mother. The stuff with Worf and the kid and the Klingon bonding ritual is good, as is the examination by Picard and Troi about the pros and cons of having family on board. Troi correctly points out that even if the kid was back on Earth, his mother still would have died. But Picard points out that Earth is not routinely ordered into the Neutral Zone. (Geordi best captain.)

Overall some good character and world building stuff, for both the Federation and Klingon culture. But the weird alien pretending to be the kids mom is boring and stupid. C Tier it is.

Booby Trap: C Tier (Bottom)



ok I admit it this whole thread was an excuse to post this video

This is the episode where Geordi creates holo-Leah Brahms and then falls in love with her because he is a socially awkward nerd who can't talk to real girls. This makes his later derision of Barclays holo-addiction pretty hypocritical of him, actually.

The rest of the episode is just sort of boring. I put it on the bottom of C Tier because while it's not as bad as your average D Tier, it's worse than your average C Tier.

The Enemy: C Tier

It's a C Tier extravaganza! In this episode, Geordi and a random Romulan are stranded on a hostile planet and must cooperate to survive. It's the far less interesting plotline. The other plot involves another Romulan survivor who is fatally wounded. Only Worf's blood can save him, because everyone else's blood won't work.

Worf refuses. The Romulans killed his parents and everyone else at Khitomer is a horrific sneak attack massacre.

Picard begs him to reconsider but doesn't order Worf to do it. Worf eventually visits the dying Romulan and informs him of the situation. The Romulan, predictably, tells Worf that he would rather die than pollute his veins with filthy animal Klingon blood.

Beverly is upset, Picard is upset, everyone is upset. Worf doesn't relent and the Romulan dies.

This was a controversial choice at the time, and honestly still is. Fans were upset and Micheal Dorn and the writers got mail about it. I, personally, think this was the correct resolution. Do I agree with Worf? No. But I also think it's in character for him. I understand why he felt that way. Nobody is perfect.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Brentai » Sun Jun 26, 2022 2:48 pm

Friday wrote:The theory goes that the show sucked until Riker grew his beard, but he had his beard in Season 2 and that was a pretty spotty season.


To be fair, it was a pretty spotty beard.

The scientist is, shockingly, extremely arrogant, shitty, and rude. I don't know what the fuck was up with TNG's writers. It's a science fiction show so why is every scientist on the fucking show just an unrepentant asshole fuckface?


I mean, Spock wasn't an unrepentant asshole, and neither are Wesley and Geordi. I accept this stock character trope as an example not of the dangers of science, but of the dangers of people who get so high on their own bullshit that they can't do good science. These guys are always portrayed as being some sort of falling star, and almost always end up violating experimental protocol for their own shitty reasons.

Of course, the real reason these guys show up in Star Trek so often is because they're trying to do Dr. Daystrom from TOS again. Yeah, that 'Daystrom'. Dr. Daystrom himself is a pretty amazing character in the wider context of Star Trek, but I'll let you figure out why on your own.

Troi correctly points out that even if the kid was back on Earth, his mother still would have died. But Picard points out that Earth is not routinely ordered into the Neutral Zone. (Geordi best captain.)


For those just following along, the reason we keep saying "Geordi is the best captain" is because the one time he takes the bridge, he immediately decides to disengage the saucer section with all the civilians on it and move it to a safe location before he takes the ship somewhere dangerous. Which is, you know, the whole point of having a detachable saucer section. The fact that Picard and Riker routinely fail to do that really calls their competence as actual ship captains into question more than it promotes Geordi (but what does promote Geordi is the fact that he manages to spin this maneuver into a way to diplomatically resolve a power struggle he gets into with Some Asshole, whose job he would later end up taking).

This is the episode where Geordi creates holo-Leah Brahms and then falls in love with her because he is a socially awkward nerd who can't talk to real girls. This makes his later derision of Barclays holo-addiction pretty hypocritical of him, actually.


He does admit that, iirc.

The Enemy: C Tier


Petition for B Tier. You point out correctly that the B-plot is preeetty punchy, and the A-plot, while very generic, is still played out pretty well.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Mongrel » Sun Jun 26, 2022 5:16 pm

Yeah, I don't see anything compelling (or rather NOT-compelling) enough in The Enemy to rate it as boring or average. I would also say B tier as it's at least decently memorable overall.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Friday » Sun Jun 26, 2022 6:29 pm

Alright, you convinced me. B Tier for The Enemy it is.

The Price: C Tier

A wormhole owned by some aliens is up for bid by multiple factions, including the Federation. Then the Ferengi show up. Also some dude who's telepathic (half betazed, maybe? I forget) who is arguing for another team falls for Troi and uses his powers to manipulate the negotiations.

Semi-interesting. The wormhole turns out to only stable on THIS end, meaning that the other end moves around all the time. This leads to the most interesting part about this episode, when the Ferengi get stranded at the other end of the wormhole in the Delta Quadrant after ignoring Data and Geordi's warning. They show back up in VOY at some point, because Delta Quadrant.

Anyway, it's fine I guess. Some decent character development for Riker and Troi's relationship.

The Vengeance Factor: C Tier

A bio-engineered virus girl is her clan's last living member and is bent on revenge. She falls in love with Riker, but it's not enough. She attempts to kill the squabbling leaders of the other clans and Riker is forced to kill her.

Pretty sad episode actually, and the message that "revenge hurts you more than it does others" is a decent one.

Bonus points for the insane mad max-like costumes for the squabbling clan members.

Oh, and this line by Worf in the middle of a firefight when the clans try to ambush the away team:

"Your ambushes would be more successful if you bathed more often!"
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby nosimpleway » Sun Jun 26, 2022 7:04 pm

Somehow missed the stop button on the first video so it was playing audio during the second one, leading to an almost flawless
Greasy: "I'llllll handle this one,"
Worf: "Sir."

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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Büge » Sun Jun 26, 2022 7:48 pm

Friday wrote:We now move on to Season 3.

Season 3 is where the show really started to hit its stride. The theory goes that the show sucked until Riker grew his beard, but he had his beard in Season 2 and that was a pretty spotty season.


I have a different metric: Season 3 is when they finally got Worf right. From a production standpoint, they finally nailed down his makeup. The ridges are much more pronounced and naturalistic than previous seasons, and his hair is looser. They'll give him a ponytail later and tighten up his moustaches, but this is where his look gets most strongly established. Michael Dorn also gave him a much more subdued performance than previous seasons, but got plenty of moments to display some acting chops. In terms of plotting, some of Worf's strongest character moments come from this season.

This was also the season that brought on Michael Piller, arguably the most important figure in TNG history. He wrote some of TNG's most beloved scripts, and was executive producer on the show from the third season until its end. He also introduced the open submissions policy on the show, which allowed non-WGA writers to submit story ideas. Some of the best episodes of the show came about from this.

Friday wrote:Evolution: D Tier


Guest star Ken Jenkins would go on to portray legendary jerk Dr. Bob Kelso on Scrubs.

Something I felt I ought to point out is that this episode attempted to put a twist on Wesley Crusher's character. In previous episodes he's been portrayed as a "wunderkind", but this one shows a less pleasant side of it. He's pushing himself to impress everybody. He's tired and overworked. He sees, as we do, what he could turn out to be in Dr. Stubbs: a neurotic, middle-aged nerd who alienates everyone around himself because he's poured himself into his work so fully that there's nothing else in his life. So Wesley wises up and admits that he made a mistake. It's not a big moment of growth, but I think it shows that the character has more depth than just the brainy kid who always shows up the adults.

But man, I feel bad for Wil Wheaton. Just look at that acne!

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How much makeup did they have to use to cover that up, I wonder.

Friday wrote:The Ensigns of Command: A Tier

Data beams down to the planet alone because it's got radiation that kills humans, which is why it was given to the Sheliak in the first place. How the humans survived at all is a mystery.


And he has a kinda-romance with a lady who builds robots that look like chintzy modern art pieces you can buy at Pier 1.

Friday wrote:The Survivors: A Tier (Bottom)

The Enterprise finds a planet that is completely reduced to ash. Inexplicably there's a patch of land 2 miles square of whatever that is an idyllic well watered lawn with some trees and a nice house on it.

Two old people are living there.


Ably played by John Anderson (MacGyver's grampa) and Anne Haney (whom you'd recognize from everything).

Friday wrote:The Bonding: C Tier

A pretty good story dragged down by a weird plot about an alien who pretends to be a dead mother. The stuff with Worf and the kid and the Klingon bonding ritual is good, as is the examination by Picard and Troi about the pros and cons of having family on board. Troi correctly points out that even if the kid was back on Earth, his mother still would have died. But Picard points out that Earth is not routinely ordered into the Neutral Zone. (Geordi best captain.)

Overall some good character and world building stuff, for both the Federation and Klingon culture. But the weird alien pretending to be the kids mom is boring and stupid. C Tier it is.


This is the episode that Michael Piller started on. It was also the episode Ronald D. Moore began on!

There was also some interesting behind-the-scenes stuff happening. Roddenberry was adamant that humans of the 24th century accept death as a part of life, so Ron Moore had to essentially write around any expression of grief. Using the alien was a clever way to get around that decree, but it's still kinda so-so.

Friday wrote:Booby Trap: C Tier (Bottom)


This was my favourite scene from the episode:



I want to see the outtake where Riker mutters, "you kissass," at Chief O'Brien.

Friday wrote:The Enemy: C Tier B Tier

Beverly is upset, Picard is upset, everyone is upset. Worf doesn't relent and the Romulan dies.

This was a controversial choice at the time, and honestly still is. Fans were upset and Micheal Dorn and the writers got mail about it. I, personally, think this was the correct resolution. Do I agree with Worf? No. But I also think it's in character for him. I understand why he felt that way. Nobody is perfect.


This is what I was talking about up top. Worf makes the kind of decision that Picard or Riker or Crusher wouldn't have made because he's Worf. As honourable as he is, he's still fallible.

Friday wrote:The Price: C Tier




Man, Riker's a pimp

Friday wrote:The Vengeance Factor: C Tier

Bonus points for the insane mad max-like costumes for the squabbling clan members.


One of them is literally wearing Okona's vest. It's amazing, the things you notice in HD. Like Wil Wheaton's acne!
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Friday » Tue Jun 28, 2022 4:41 pm

The Defector: A Tier

A Romulan "clerk" defects to the Federation, barely escaping hot pursuit. He informs Picard that the Romulans are planning an invasion and that he's seen oodles of evidence cross his desk that they're building and moving troops to a secret base on a planet in the Neutral Zone.

Picard is skeptical, especially when an analysis of the chase of the defectors shuttle and the pursuing warbird reveals that the warbird must have let him escape. Is he a spy, then, sent to lure them into the Neutral Zone and into a trap?

Eventually after a bunch of back and forth where the defector keeps pushing his agenda claiming that "there's no time for this bullshit, you need to stop this now or the Romulan Empire will start a war" the defector reveals he is not, in fact, a clerk, but an Admiral. Admiral Jarok, in fact, infamous in the Federation for being the Commander of the massacre at the Norkan outposts. He retorts that in his society he is considered "the hero of the Norkan campaigns. One world's butcher is another world's hero. Perhaps I am neither one." He also agrees to reveal Romulan fleet positions and tactical data should the Enterprise come under attack.

This convinces Picard and he makes a call to the Klingons that is only briefly mentioned on screen. He then orders the separation of the saucer section and -- just kidding he takes all 700+ civilians (including children) with him into a war-torn zone that will almost certainly involve ship to ship combat and violence and possibly even boarding parties attempting to take control of the Enterprise. Geordi best captain.

All of it leads to this.



There are certainly better episodes, but that scene above is about as good as Trek ever gets.

God, can you even imagine how fucking pissed those Klingons were when a fight didn't break out? I guess they probably consoled themselves by making fun of how the Romulans turned tail and ran away like the filthy cowards they are, unable to bring themselves to engage in a fair fight where victory wasn't assured.

Trek is famous for its weirdo episodes with weirdo one shot aliens who do weirdo shit, but I've always really enjoyed the more "mundane" stuff with conventional enemies and political intrigue. That's part of the reason why I love DS9 so much, because it really leans heavily on that side of Trek.

Not that episodes with an actual Greek God in it or whatever are bad. They are super enjoyable as well. But this is an excellent example of a Trek episode where nothing absurd happens, and there's not even really a lesson or moral. It's just pure military strategy, deception, and tactical brilliance. This is the kind of shit that sets old Trek Captains (Kirk, Picard, Sisko, and to a lesser extent Janeway and Archer) apart from the newer, more emotionally overcharged Trek.

The Hunted: B Tier (Top)

VIETNAM VETS WERE IGNORED AND MARGINALIZED AND DESERVE TO BE TREATED BETTER, THE EPISODE

One of the best action episodes of Trek outside of "Die Hard on the Enterprise" which doesn't happen till season 6. A super soldier from an alien world seeking entry into the Federation escapes his gilded prison and it's up to the Enterprise to recapture him. But he's immune to life sign sensors and has a host of tricks up his sleeve, including the ability to resist transporters.

Probably the one time that Worf losing a 1v1 actually makes a bit of sense. In the end, Picard leaves the aliens to work out their problems for themselves and denies them entry because if your idea of "taking care of your vets" is sending them to a prison moon you probably aren't ready to be inducted into the quadrant's most enlightened conglomerate.

The High Ground: B Tier

The Terrorism episode. Famously has a line where Data and Picard talk about the political effectiveness of terrorist acts and Data mentions "The Irish Reuinfication of 2024" which got the episode banned and censored in the UK and the Republic of Ireland at launch. It didn't air on the BBC with the Ireland scene intact until 2007, and to date it STILL has not aired on RTÉ, the official national broadcaster of the Republic of Ireland.

Some people are down on this episode because it apparently lacks a clear message about terrorism, whether it's always bad no matter what, or if it's acceptable if all other avenues to freedom from oppression have been closed.

Timely, and not just because of the 2024 reference. Personally, I think they eyeballed it a few years early, but we still haven't entirely left the Deus Ex and Trek timeline until we pass 2024 without a reunification.

Deja Q: A Tier (Top)

Red aLErt.

s8 summation:
Guinan stabs Q with a fork. Q makes Data laugh.

de Lancie knocks it out of the park as usual. Even naked and powerless, he still manages to control the situation. A moon is falling into a planet and everyone thinks Q is behind it and fucking with them. Contains maybe my favorite dialog exchange between Picard, Q, and Worf:

Picard: "Return that moon to its orbit!"
Q: "I have no powers! Q, the ordinary!"
Picard: "Q, the liar! Q, the misanthrope!"
Q: "Q, the miserable! Q, the desperate! What must I do to convince you people?"
Worf: "Die."
Q: "Oh, very clever, Worf. Eat any good books lately?"

Some sentient energy gas shows up and wants to kill Q because he used to torment them. The Enterprise dutifully protects Q from his enemy until finally Q just gives up and goes to commit suicide because he hates being human. But another Q reinstates his powers after he points out that part of the reason Q was gonna kill himself was to save the Enterprise and let it fix the moon problem without the gas dudes interfering. So Q gets his powers back and then the actual no meme best scene in TNG happens.



I'm tempted to put this into S Tier, even.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Mongrel » Tue Jun 28, 2022 7:20 pm

Weird. The video of the scene from The Defector is "unavailable". Not copyright, not taken down... just I dunno. IDGI - it's the official channel and it's been up for 9 years. Maybe it'll be back later?

w/e ever here's a working one if not, because it IS a great scene:

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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Büge » Tue Jun 28, 2022 8:34 pm

Oh! I forgot to mention that actor Andreas Katsulas (RIP) guest-starred as Tomalak in The Enemy. He is best known as Ambassador G'Kar on Babylon 5, and he reprises the role of Tomalak in...

Friday wrote:The Defector: A Tier

this is an excellent example of a Trek episode where nothing absurd happens, and there's not even really a lesson or moral. It's just pure military strategy, deception, and tactical brilliance. This is the kind of shit that sets old Trek Captains (Kirk, Picard, Sisko, and to a lesser extent Janeway and Archer) apart from the newer, more emotionally overcharged Trek.


As good as this episode is, it does kinda set a precedent for future episodes where the climax is the Romulans show up, there's some kinda tense standoff, then they slink back into the shadows. They'd go this well a little too many times, IMO. It's no wonder the producers introduced the Cardassians later as recurring heavies.

Friday wrote:The Hunted: B Tier (Top)

VIETNAM VETS WERE IGNORED AND MARGINALIZED AND DESERVE TO BE TREATED BETTER, THE EPISODE


Boy, that Prime Minister guy looks familiar. I dunno where I've seen him before. I'm sure it'll come to me.

Friday wrote:Deja Q: A Tier (Top)

Red aLErt.


Also immortalized in CCG card form.

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I gotta wonder how many of these de Lancie has autographed.

Friday wrote:Contains maybe my favorite dialog exchange between Picard, Q, and Worf:

Picard: "Return that moon to its orbit!"
Q: "I have no powers! Q, the ordinary!"
Picard: "Q, the liar! Q, the misanthrope!"
Q: "Q, the miserable! Q, the desperate! What must I do to convince you people?"
Worf: "Die."
Q: "Oh, very clever, Worf. Eat any good books lately?"


One of my favourite sequences in the whole show.



"ROMULAN!"
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Friday » Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:59 pm

A Matter of Perspective: D Tier

Riker seduces a man's wife and then kills him. Or does he? Let's get this boring, stupid episode from three separate perspectives. When VOY copied this episode, nearly fucking word for word, they added a dog at the end as the key witness. This means that the shitty knock-off version of this ep is the superior version.

Yesterday's Enterprise: A Tier

Fan favorite episode, I think this episode might be in a lot of people's S Tiers, or at least top of A. I find it... slightly boring. The concept is good and seeing Tasha come back is great. I especially liked the scene with her when she asks Castillo if he eats pieces of shit for breakfast.

I don't actually have a lot to say about this ep. It's a great ep and a final sendoff for Tasha that will actually have impact in the normal universe in the form of SELA, HER RAPE BABY WHO HATES HER???? what the fuck.

Before Worf vanishes from the rest of the episode due to the timechange, he gets a great scene with Guinan where he first tries prune juice and fucking loves it, dubbing it "a warrior's drink." This eventually (years later and on another show) leads to second best scene in all of Trek:



Additional fun fact: after the timeline is restored and everything reverts, Geordi goes to ten-forward to talk to Guinan and he's still wearing his alternate, more militant uniform.

Also I love Jonathan Frakes:

Jonathan Frakes admitted, "To this day I do not understand 'Yesterday's Enterprise'. I do not know what the fuck happened in that episode."


The Offspring: A Tier (Bottom)

Data makes another android and lets them choose their gender. They pick female and Riker, elsewhere on the ship, is instantly notified via his sudden flared nostrils and pupil dilation. He makes his way to ten-forward immediately.

Then this scene happens.



I know, I know. I can't just like episodes because they feature Riker macking on honeys. Except fuck you, yes I can.

The rest of the episode is more boring android reproductive rights blah blah blah Picard disobeys a direct order from a superior officer to prevent his crewman from handing over his child to the state blah blah blah who cares about this woke well written bullshit I want more Riker mackin' on the honeys

Lal's death is legit heartbreaking, but don't worry, she'll live on forever in Data's brain. And in the future, he'll even model his own twin daughters after her just kidding he forgets completely because the ST: Picard writers have never seen TNG

Sins of the Father: B Tier (Top)

Tony Todd shows up as Kurn, Worf's long lost brother. He informs Worf that some shit is going down in the Klingon High council about their dad.

Brentai is absolutely correct that Riker should have been chosen as cha'DIch when Kurn is wounded. But I still like this episode quite a bit. In fact, it's pretty much the only Klingon centric episode I do enjoy wholeheartedly. It gives Stewart a chance to really show his shakespearean acting chops:



This episodes sets in motion a TON of later Klingon shit, both in TNG and DS9. Pretty much every single Klingon episode after this one is a sequel in some way. Worf's discommendation and his shame over it informs his character arc and development from now on going forward, forever.

Kurn is a fan favorite and what happened to him in DS9 is a fucking travesty and a definite low point for the series.

Allegiance: C Tier

Here's the important part of this episode:



The rest is a boring drag. There sure are a whole lot of aliens out there who mean no harm but will still kidnap the fuck out of you. And also try to pilot your ship into a sun. "We meant no harm" my fucking ass you assholes
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Mongrel » Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:31 pm

I'm not sure if I would place Yesterday's Enterprise in S tier myself, but Rachel Garrett is my third favourite portrayal of a Starfleet Captain across all of Star Trek, after the most obvious two. In one short episode, she manages to present her character as a more coherent, relatable commander than Janeway did *at any point* in seven years, never mind the ones which came after her.

If you want to fight me about Sisko, well, he's a great character and commander, but his hybrid role makes him a bit odd to assess, plus there was the occasional highly questionable command decision, which made for great writing but, uh.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Friday » Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:44 pm

Yeah, Garrett is def a high point of the episode.

Sisko isn't the best captain, (he's technically a commander for most of ds9's run, but you know what I mean) but he is the best lead.

His ... moral and ethical flexibility is one of the reasons he's so great. Picard is the LG, Kirk the NG, and Sisko the CG.

And Janeway the CN.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Mongrel » Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:57 pm

Mongrel wrote:
Mothra wrote:The only good TNG episode is the one where the starship Enterprise encounters a haunted temple in space and it turns the ship into a temple, and Brent Spiner plays like 4 increasingly insane characters.

Hey! Yesterday's Enterprise wants a word with you buddy!

Oh, and I actually totally misremembered the title here, implying Yesterday's Enterprise was my favourite.

That would be Cause and Effect.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Mongrel » Wed Jun 29, 2022 3:03 pm

Probably put a Fistful of Datas as #2 (like your own lists, these are not objective assessment of how EXCELLENT an episode is), and after that

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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Brentai » Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:24 pm

Friday wrote:Allegiance: C Tier
...
There sure are a whole lot of aliens out there who mean no harm but will still kidnap the fuck out of you.


Was recently reminded by my YouTube recs of one thing that elevates this episode a bit, which is that at the end Picard forgoes the usual Trek thing of being humbled by the power of the more advanced race and hoping one day the promise that humanity has shown will allow it to grow beyond its primitive limitations and blah blah blah. Instead he just traps the aliens in a force field of his own and is like "How do you butt-chins like it huh???" before letting them go with a standing threat if they ever try that again.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Friday » Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:43 pm

Yeah, I do enjoy that ending. I actually had this originally at bottom of C, but that ending bumped it up in my mind.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Mongrel » Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:06 am

I was watching stupid clips when I tripped over this ancient vidja shitpost

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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Büge » Mon Jul 04, 2022 8:38 am

Friday wrote:A Matter of Perspective: D Tier

Riker seduces a man's wife and then kills him. Or does he? Let's get this boring, stupid episode from three separate perspectives. When VOY copied this episode, nearly fucking word for word, they added a dog at the end as the key witness. This means that the shitty knock-off version of this ep is the superior version.


The Rashomon-style plot is a cute conceit, but the BIG TWIST of the episode relies on the fact that the holodeck's replica of the lab is so flawless that it can perfectly recreate the accident that caused the scientist's death. Even in a show as silly as Trek, it strains the imagination.

Friday wrote:Yesterday's Enterprise: A Tier


This was perhaps the most successful of the spec scripts which were submitted through Michael Piller's open submissions policy. It also included (but was never filmed) Wesley crusher getting decapitated. I shudder to think of all the Wesley detractors who would overuse that clip had it made it to screen.

Friday wrote:The Offspring: A Tier (Bottom)

Lal's death is legit heartbreaking, but don't worry, she'll live on forever in Data's brain. And in the future, he'll even model his own twin daughters after her just kidding he forgets completely because the ST: Picard writers have never seen TNG


Every time I consider sitting down and watching Star Trek Picard, I see reasons not to.

Friday wrote:Sins of the Father: B Tier (Top)


Alternate title: A Worf for All Seasons

And yeah, they did Kurn dirty.

Friday wrote:Allegiance: C TierThere sure are a whole lot of aliens out there who mean no harm but will still kidnap the fuck out of you. And also try to pilot your ship into a sun. "We meant no harm" my fucking ass you assholes


It never occurred to me until you put it that way, but those aliens are "It was just a joke" guys writ large.
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Re: TNG Episode Tier List

Postby Friday » Tue Jul 05, 2022 3:06 am

sorry for the delay, i've been having some more bullshit in my life that is keeping me busy.

in the meantime, here's this:



love the TOS pronunciation.
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