FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

User avatar
Blossom
Posts: 2268
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:58 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Blossom » Sat May 01, 2021 3:59 pm

I haven't been too active in recent months. Burned out a little, letting it chill rather than forcing it. But yeah, I'm on Crystal.
Image

User avatar
beatbandito
Posts: 3416
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:04 am

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby beatbandito » Sat May 01, 2021 5:48 pm

Büge wrote:I'm on Aether/Sargatanas, so

So noted.

Mongrel wrote:Curious how shard transfers work in FFXIV? So many online games seem to handle that in so many different ways.

And yeah, there is a pay service that seems to be open to any shard right now, so I could go full play if there's a slot in a group on another shard. But I would probably save the paid transfer until I have at least one class at current content.
Image

User avatar
Smiler
Imperisaurus Rex
Posts: 968
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 6:27 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Smiler » Sun May 02, 2021 3:46 am

Supposedly they're going to have cross data server visiting working right before the next expansion comes out.

User avatar
pacobird
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:25 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby pacobird » Sun May 02, 2021 10:58 pm

I'm on Balmung but I think I'm done for the moment, and have basically played 14 as a single player game since the end of ARR.
Image

User avatar
beatbandito
Posts: 3416
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:04 am

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby beatbandito » Mon May 10, 2021 10:30 am

Thinking about the stuff FFXIV does well, and the stuff it does that still feels a unnecessary or more obtuse than they need to be for an MMO.

And I think ultimately the game's strength lays in the idea of the inn rooms. You can go to an inn room and go to bed, and that logs you out. Log back in on that character and they play a wake-up animation in the inn room. Similarly with the limited route boats, airships, etc. You can cheaply teleport anywhere that you've already been, or take a series of transportation and walking that takes longer and costs only marginally less. There are a bunch of other similar features spattered throughout, too.

That kind of experience you build for people who like it to embrace or people who don't (even just for the moment or that night or whatever) can skip it and just get to the gameplay they care about. I think that's an important balance that I've been looking for recently.
Image

User avatar
Büge
Posts: 4047
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 6:56 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Büge » Mon May 10, 2021 4:47 pm

Also, there's a whole real estate market ingame.
Image

User avatar
pacobird
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:25 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby pacobird » Fri May 14, 2021 4:41 pm

beatbandito wrote:Thinking about the stuff FFXIV does well, and the stuff it does that still feels a unnecessary or more obtuse than they need to be for an MMO.

And I think ultimately the game's strength lays in the idea of the inn rooms. You can go to an inn room and go to bed, and that logs you out. Log back in on that character and they play a wake-up animation in the inn room. Similarly with the limited route boats, airships, etc. You can cheaply teleport anywhere that you've already been, or take a series of transportation and walking that takes longer and costs only marginally less. There are a bunch of other similar features spattered throughout, too.

That kind of experience you build for people who like it to embrace or people who don't (even just for the moment or that night or whatever) can skip it and just get to the gameplay they care about. I think that's an important balance that I've been looking for recently.


Yes, it's definitely the best and worst part of the game post-storyline, as you'd expect would follow from what's so obviously the core motivating design philosophy. It's the best for the reasons you describe: once you're caught up on the MSQ the game isn't interested in shunting you into any particular activity so it's as respectful or contemptuous of your time as you want it to be. You don't even need to cap your tomestones for the week if you don't want to because having the best gear available to you at any given time just doesn't really matter that much unless you are a Savage Guy.

On the other hand, I find it quite hard to actually stay invested in the game when nothing I do feels like it matters in the way I want MMO progression to feel. To fall back on unfortunate but inevitable comparisons, fun and powerful new gear in WoW feels genuinely impactful because you get to use that new power in everything you do. The stuff you did yesterday is easier today, and you really do feel like you're making progress. XIV syncs and restricts your power in so many contexts and directs your attention towards so many things that barely involve combat at all that it just doesn't feel like you're going anywhere. And I mean, that's fine - I've been doing the MMO thing long enough to understand why it's probably for the best for a game to basically be a Content Checklist that you go through and then are done until the next update - but I cannot for the life of me understand what drives my FC friends to log in every day.
Image

User avatar
Friday
Posts: 4847
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:40 pm
Location: A user of Sosuns

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Friday » Fri May 14, 2021 7:34 pm

It's also present in their PvP design. Everyone is given set stats regardless of level and gear.

This equalizes everything to pure skill and class comp of your team. It also removes the nice little dopamine hit I used to get when I would log in on Tuesday and roll up to my Conquest Vendor and pick out a nice new shiny set of boots.

The Yin and Yang of MMO design.
ImageImageImage

User avatar
Romosome
Posts: 294
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 7:14 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Romosome » Sat May 29, 2021 7:56 pm

The pull of the MOON has taken hold. I dove back in and I'm preparing for Endwalker. Maou and I are on Excalibur, and we're talking with bandito about uniting the tribes, congregating on a single server, and starting a Free Company, with a house and everything.

The question is what server/realm of course. We've been considering Goblin, as Maou wants to get off Excalibur onto a lower pop realm. From reading the thread, it seems we have people also on Midgarsormr, Sargatanas, and Balmung.

If you're interested in transferring to play together, please reply. If Goblin is fine, say so. If you'd like to nominate a different server and convince people to come to you, say which one and I'll make a poll.

And yes I'm playing just because of Soken. He got me.

User avatar
mharr
Posts: 1271
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 11:54 am
Location: UK

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby mharr » Sat May 29, 2021 10:24 pm

I've heard this one has a fixed correct way to play each class to the point that everyone's skill rotations are designed around everyone else aligning buffs and attacks to the second. Is that just an optional end-game raid thing or does it apply to everything that's not solo?

User avatar
Blossom
Posts: 2268
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:58 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Blossom » Sat May 29, 2021 10:29 pm

mharr wrote:I've heard this one has a fixed correct way to play each class to the point that everyone's skill rotations are designed around everyone else aligning buffs and attacks to the second. Is that just an optional end-game raid thing or does it apply to everything that's not solo?


optional high-end raiding endgame thing, and there's a lot of flex in it, you do not need to tryhard that hard even in that content
Image

User avatar
Romosome
Posts: 294
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 7:14 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Romosome » Sat May 29, 2021 11:31 pm

Yeah that's literally just there so the hardcore raiders are happy.

99% of the game and its voluminous side-content is singleplayer friendly. In the last two expansions they even added the Trust system where you can run dungeons with your quest NPC friends, so you don't have to even queue with other people for those.

But parallel play is fun so let's make a house together

User avatar
Grath
Posts: 2027
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 7:34 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Grath » Sun May 30, 2021 12:00 am

Romosome wrote:But parallel play is fun so let's make a house together

I thought FF14's housing crisis rivaled America's, so you needed someone very dedicated camping out waiting for new housing plots to be released in order to have a chance at buying a house for a reasonable price?

User avatar
Blossom
Posts: 2268
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:58 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Blossom » Sun May 30, 2021 1:20 am

Depends on the server.
Image

User avatar
Romosome
Posts: 294
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 7:14 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Romosome » Tue Jun 01, 2021 12:44 am

Grath wrote:
Romosome wrote:But parallel play is fun so let's make a house together

I thought FF14's housing crisis rivaled America's, so you needed someone very dedicated camping out waiting for new housing plots to be released in order to have a chance at buying a house for a reasonable price?


Yes, but much like America, it's still possible. And far easier if you have a group looking together.

The good news is that unlike America, gil is plentiful at this point so the prices aren't as "unreasonable" as they used to be. Endwalker's also adding new housing districts, so if we can't find a guild house by November, there'll be a whole wave opening up.

User avatar
pacobird
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:25 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby pacobird » Tue Jun 01, 2021 2:58 pm

mharr wrote:I've heard this one has a fixed correct way to play each class to the point that everyone's skill rotations are designed around everyone else aligning buffs and attacks to the second. Is that just an optional end-game raid thing or does it apply to everything that's not solo?


Theoretical max DPS for any given class involves play optimization that dwarfs what you'd encounter in WoW, but it only matters in max-difficulty raiding because that content is by-design the only stuff that has mechanics like enrage timers that require a certain level of DPS. For anything else you're more than fine finding a FOO strategy that works for you on a class you like and otherwise just paying attention.
Image

User avatar
Blossom
Posts: 2268
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:58 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby Blossom » Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:18 pm

pacobird wrote:
mharr wrote:I've heard this one has a fixed correct way to play each class to the point that everyone's skill rotations are designed around everyone else aligning buffs and attacks to the second. Is that just an optional end-game raid thing or does it apply to everything that's not solo?


Theoretical max DPS for any given class involves play optimization that dwarfs what you'd encounter in WoW, but it only matters in max-difficulty raiding because that content is by-design the only stuff that has mechanics like enrage timers that require a certain level of DPS. For anything else you're more than fine finding a FOO strategy that works for you on a class you like and otherwise just paying attention.


so, here's the slightly more complex explanation

Abilities in the game come in two forms, generally called GCDs and oGCDs. GCDs are called that because they are on a G]/b]lobal [b]Cool Down. By default, this is 2.5 seconds, or slightly less if you have haste on your gear. This means that when you use a GCD ability, it triggers a 2.5 second cooldown on all your other GCD abilities, and you can't use another until that time is up. There are usually orders in which you should use GCDs, combos that lead into each other, but this is explained in the game and specific to the job. Broadly, you can use any GCD you have, at any time the GCD is up.

oGCDs are off-global cooldowns. They are things you can use at any time, barring animation lock, including between your GCD abilities while that's refreshing itself. Usually, in the 2.5 seconds you have, you can use one oGCD without issue, and sometimes two if you're quick. This is called weaving - sticking an oGCD or two between your GCDs. Using two in between is called double-weaving. oGCDs generally have a larger cooldown, so you're not using the same thing between every two attacks.

This is probably all familiar from WoW, I never played it but a lot of games work like that. But, with terminology established, it should be said that there are more complex, group-specific ways to sync up everything so group-wide buffs are multiplicative and the most attacks happen inside them. If you want to do the very best you can, with a fixed group, that's important to study. But, that aside? If you're hitting your GCDs in the right order, on cooldown, and not waiting to hit something or missing your combos, and just hitting every oGCD as soon as it's up? Learn how to weave, and double weave sometimes? You'll be outperforming the majority of players, and be doing well enough to clear most of the hardest content in the game. It's really more about always doing something than it is to be doing Everything Absolutely Perfectly.

Perfect Play of a job isn't always intuitive, and sometimes can get weird. Good Enough For Everything play of every job is very intuitive, and easy to learn. I can give examples, but it's really pretty easy to pick up, and there's lots of resources and ways to experiment if you want to try to do better. For the most part, even the complicated jobs are Pretty Obvious.
Image

User avatar
pacobird
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:25 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby pacobird » Tue Jun 01, 2021 11:56 pm

And the best part is all the jobs play pretty differently and some are definitely simpler than others of you don't want to think about all the DPS you're not doing by playing sub-optimally.
Image

User avatar
beatbandito
Posts: 3416
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:04 am

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby beatbandito » Wed Jun 02, 2021 9:06 am

There is no variability in builds for jobs/classes. So anyone playing the same class should be playing pretty identically in any given situation. But the difficulty rarely calls for true perfection.


Meanwhile, if anyone already did the trial and is interested in getting back in: the non-steam version has a rare sale going on at $24 for the complete edition giving you all current content.
Image

User avatar
pacobird
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:25 pm

Re: FINAL FANTASY ONLINE 2-2 Not shit edition

Postby pacobird » Wed Jun 02, 2021 11:33 am

No, I mean the jobs themselves vary. There is an objectively correct way to play RDM, as you say, but that is much, much easier than the objectively correct way to play NIN.
Image

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests